The EU - yet again...
3 November 2012
...is in the news and pretty much as usual for all the wrong reasons.
...is in the news and pretty much as usual for all the wrong reasons.
The EU Commission lives in a different world to the rest of us. It is one where they are the most important people in the universe and in which their dictates can never be wrong. They see themselves as the font of all European good and wisdom. Those who disagree are wild extremists and any defiance of their wishes by the common herd is not tolerated.
This truth is clearly demonstrated by their repeated demands to increase their budget and spend more money. National governments may have to be cutting back on their excessive expenditure, the economy is in serious trouble and the Euro causing chaos and destruction in the EU's slave states in the south. But they, the EU commission's will and the 'great European project' must come first. They must increase their budget to be paid for by nation states even despite all else.
The EU is a despicable organisation. Bullying, lying, corrupt, incompetent, all of these are accurate descriptions of this organisation.
We are told that we 'must be at the heart of European decision making' that we must 'work with our European partners' that co-operation and good will are important. Balderdash - it does not work, it has not worked in the past and will not work in the future.
The only real and significant success we have had in European diplomacy was when Mrs T swung her handbag and got Britain a rebate. Forget the Major opt-outs, that was caving in and a treaty too far.
The only way with the EU is to treat them in the manner it deserves. That swinging handbag. Gum up their works with a veto, refuse to co-operate, tell them some home truths. Shatter the EU complacency and make life much harder for them.
Make them want to kick us out or, at least make them want to renegotiate the terms of Britain's membership and to repatriate powers back to the UK. Make them want to give us what we really want, a Swiss-like arrangement. Make life impossible for them if they do not. That is what we should be doing.
That cannot be done while LibDems are part of the government but think this. The Conservative Party is no longer split between a pro-EU wing and Euroscepticism. The split is between those who want us out of the EU and those who want less EU interference. The Europhiles in the Conservative Party are a spent force of old men who have had their day.
The rebellion this week shows the strength of feeling on the Conservative benches. Do not imagine a rebellion of nearly 20% of the Conservative MPs is a small thing, it is far from that given the power and patronage of the Whips Office and Leader. No-one has a chance of being selected to stand as an MP by a Conservative panel who declares him or herself to be pro-EU. Only degrees of Euroscepticism stands a chance with the loudest cheers for those who are most anti EU. A Conservative Government with an overall majority will have no choice but to tackle the EU problem head-on. Things will then be very interesting.
- Tom, the EU does not have an electorate. That is why being governed by it is unacceptable to anyone who professes to have democratic principles.
- Barry, the Tory leadership is adamantly pro-EU. They also want Turkey and other countries to join the EU. Why do you not see this? The Tory party DOES NOT campaign for Britain to leave the EU, but for Britain to remain in the EU.
Your party is PRO-EU! - the party is most definitely anti the union, as for the leadership in general, they don't seem to know what they want.
- If the Tory leadership do not know what they want, then this means the majority of the Government do not know what they want. Such a situation is no good to our Country.
- Alexander - another example of you not knowing what you are talking about. Total twaddle as always.
- barry
alec makes a valid point on this issue the big 3 in the blues are very careful in their utterances over europe. in my view they don't see it as a big issue in the way their voters do.
echoes of the last government not listening to their core support over eastern european immigration. - The only trouble with all this euroscepticism is that by leaving the club we are left alone with the pitifully inept and incompetent political leaders we are burdened with. Can you really imagine Cameron, Clegg or Milliband actually taking our country forward and creating trading links with the world outside of the EU?
Nope neither can I.
Much as I hate the EU it has to be said that to leave would leave us all even more impoverished than we are now. It is economic suicide to do so. - i don't see where you are going on this philip, trade with the european union member states would be unaffected by our status, we import a lot more than we export.
- Howard over time the eu will find ways of making our position very, very difficult in terms of trading with them. As it stands they are doing their best to weaken our position as a world financial hub and that is under the current state where we are more or less fully paid up members of the club. Imagine how difficult it would be by our being on the outside. They would make our lives even more miserable by making financial services in the UK as difficult as it is possible to make.
Now remember how the climate change act, supported by virtually every single MP, was passed and how I warned that it would make us less competitive than we already are? Remember when I said that our energy bills would double over the next few years because of our ridiculous energy policy which is non existent? Remember how no political leader has even managed to grapple with our aviation hub status so still there are no plans for expansion of this money earner?
Remember also that Cameron has neither the wit or intelligence to get out there and battle for Britain's best interests. He is hamstrung by his own obsession with saving polar bears and stopping rising sea levels instead of pursuing grown up economic and political issues. Remember that Cameron is proud of his largesse in terms of giving 0.7% of OUR money every year to countries who don't need it?
That's just for starters.
I won't bother bringing Clegg or Milliband into this but I think you might get the picture.
If I had confidence in our leaders to go out there on our own in the world I'd fully support leaving the eu but given the circumstances I think it safer to remain in the position we are in. - Barry, I simply can't see the logic in your presented points:
The Tory leadership is adamantly pro EU.
They have presented no plan for Britain leaving the EU, nor for a referendum on in/out.
They speak out in favour of the present EU system, and call for more countries to join it.
Anyone believing that the Tory party is currently for us leaving the European Union, might as well believe that Santaclaus descends the chimney with a sack of presents. - "Joint statement Traian Basescu – David Cameron: EU expansion to West Balkans, Turkey, Republic of Moldova". From Hotnews 6 June 2011:
“ We have agreed today on a programme of joint work between our two countries to promote economic growth in the European Union, to enlarge it to the Western Balkans, Turkey and the Republic of Moldova..."
Sorry Barry, the evidence is there! - "The fortnightly Opinium poll for the Observer is out here. Topline figures are CON 30%, LAB 41%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 10%."
Barry, the number of UKIP supporters is equal to one third of the number of Tory supporters.
UKIP's support has gone up 3 times since May 2010 (from 3.5%).
The Tory's support has gone down by about a third.
The leaderless attitude of your party and its outright campaigning for the EU will lead it into the opposition before long, as things stand now. Because people just do not want to see millions more people from all these other countries that the Conservative leadership is trying to get into the EU, flooding over here looking for work, houses and the jolly "everything is free in UK".
What people will read come election time, is snippets of headlines such as the one I posted above (or below), especially in the last week leading up to the polling day, in a massive letterbox campaign and through billboards in the streets, and on ads on TV.
Oh and don't get me wrong: I'm not politically affiliated, but some good strategical advice....
Unless, of-course, the attitude changes, and the Tories do a U-turn on the EU, and stop messing about with us. Bye! - From the Telegraph 6 August 2010:
"The poll by ComRes for the Independent newspaper came as a separate survey by the ConservativeHome website found that six out of 10 grassroots Tory supporters wanted their party to enter into an alliance with UKIP."
Perhaps they will simply walk over to UKIP if the Tory leadership continues its outright campaign for EU membership and expansion.
At that point, the EU Tories will be a sad minority. Their whole support bases will collapse, as millions of former Tory voters abandon them.
The question is, could this happen within the next few months?
Within its whole history, the Conservative party has never been on the edge of total collapse as now!
Are we seeing history being written in real-time? - Sorry, the date on the last post should read: 6 August 2012.
Since then, incidentally, Tory support has fallen by 10%. - Peter, I don't we in the UK can complain of a lack of Democracy with the EU. Within the EU there are electorates though. Electorates who are not inextricably bound to any one notion of what the EU stands for or it's path into the future.
I did read in the Telegraph yesterday, a readers letter from one of your 'locals', that he (a Mr. Bacon, if memory serves) shared a Concorde flight with Ted Heath and words were exchanged on Europe. Ted averred that the EU was always going to mean closer and closer Economic and Political union.
Yet there are more ways to skin this cat than are put forward by the present regime.
We could do worse in matters Democracy than begin at home. It is high time the Electorate(s) got themselves more involved, as little consideration is given them by their respective 'representatives' at home or in Brussels.
And I do not mean, Referendum, as that is a fairly meaningless term, far outweighed and overshadowed by the actual issue, the 'question' to be put.
Perhaps it is only natural for the arguments on Europe that are Party-Political to be offered in terms of Us and Them, but there is a far larger 'we' component. Across Europe no population is content to be governed by a cabal. Be it, quasi or pseudo democratic.
Again, there is way too much of an equating Politics with party-politicians, Politics IS people.
"[see themselves as] the most important people in the universe"
"Those who disagree are wild extremists and any defiance of their wishes by the common herd is not tolerated."
From 'Downing Street Gate-gate', to the incessant dismissal of any and all dissent on these pages; clearly having two Conservative Blocs is one too many, or to be fair to myself, at least one too many.
"Bullying, lying, corrupt, incompetent"
While it would be unfair to single-out the Tories here they do have their place, call it their self inflicted harm or merely their poorly managed concealment of long-established practice, unseemly in our modern world. For a political Party any attempt at denial could only serve to ram the point home.
But, you pays your money and you takes your choice. At least with the EU they have not attempted to claim a fixed-term for themselves.
The sugar-coated Emetic of the EEC has morphed into a hard to swallow pill, not because it's aims have altered, but because it's prescription has it's prescribers names upon it.
Those who dealt it now smell it.
Yet, all in all, I cannot but agree. The EU should reconfigure itself, re-ground itself. Not with any new inter-Governmental relationship, but one more Democratic and accountable to the general electorate. The EU should not be brought back into line with Party Political wishes, but should work first and foremost for it's Electorate. It's grant of citizenship to the people of the UK should not be sacrificed upon the altar of some Global-Economic tax-exempt Plutocracy, home grown or otherwise.