howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
a report was issued today by the inspector of prisons accusing our local removal centre of being more like a prison.
surely this begs the question, "why did the inspector of prisons inspect it then"?
Terry Nunn
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,302
Yes, it was a rather strange statement Howard considering it IS a prison.
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
It should not be a prison - it is for people including children who have come from potentially threatening homelands seeking help. That there are some who exploit this should not mean we demean and imperil vulnerable and needy individuals who have taken the difficult step of leaving everything they have known for a hostile country.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I don't believe that's quite right Bern.
The Immigration Removal Centre is just that, a Removal Centre - for people who attempts to stay here have failed.
Some of them have tried for years to stay here, many under false pretences. They have gone through all the due processes of law (and there can be many things they can hide behind and much money made by their lawyers) and still found to be illegal.
My question would be, if they've been found to be illegal, why aren't they just flown home instead of keeping them here.
Roger
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
if they are deportees why havent they been deported,the whole thing beggers belief.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
The 'inmates' are more of less free to roam the site as much as they like, socialise, football, gymnasium, shop, learning, a very successful charity bike workshop.
Been nice knowing you :)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i must concur with roger here, if they are here illegally, why are they not shown the door?
Having had the "pleasure" of working at dover immigration removal centre as an officer for 24 years before I retired, I had an insight as to how difficult it is to "remove" these detainees.When it first opened as a removal centre we took mostly those that were illegal immigrants and those that had overstayed their welcome.Now 90% are ex-cons who have commited offences in this country and have finished their sentences, so they can no longer be kept in mainstream prisons, therefore they are sent to places like dover. The problem lies with their country of origin as most places are considered unsafe to remove them to.As to the report of children being incarcerated, It is very difficult to tell the age of some of the young men if they have no documentation when they are picked up. If the odd one slips through the net they are or were quickly removed to more suitable accommodation, until this happens they have to be kept away from the adult population for their safety.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i heard that things have got rather unpleasant up there now phil.
inmates are leaving their shoes outside their cells at night, come the morning they are still unpolished.
not good enough.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
Wow ! that's disgraceful Howard.
I have heard that many in their early middle 20's say they are children (under 16 ?) and so are not treated as adults.
I thought there were very few places in the World deemed as dangerous; also if they are genuine asylum seekers fleeing terrorisms and acts of violence against them, they should be seeking a safe haven in the closest country to their own.
Whether their home country is somewhere like Somalia, Iran or Iraq, there are many, many safe countries between there and here, so seeking a safe haven is not their prime objective - getting into Britain is, because their perception of what we will give them once they get here, is that they will get a nice new set of teeth and a big house - and that perception needs to be changed.
Roger
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
there does seem to be a lot of afgans/iraqis in calias at the moment surely they could be sent back to country of origin,like most of them here.i dont know if anybody has seen the program uk border force on telly recently,really eye opening in the antics these people get up to.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
surely if the inmates are convicted felons, it is their problem what happens to them in their country of origin.
While I am absolutely in support of discouraging and removing undesirables and those who put us at risk, I disagree that many flee to UK because it is a soft touch. That may be true in some cases, but in most it is because they have ties here (albeit possibly illegal ties) or admire the UK (go figure!) I am sure that if you were to hear and understand some of the very genuine stories behind people who are being demonised by those who manipulate biddable minds you would want to offer them sanctuary. Sanctuary does not mean preference or better treatment - it means a safe haven and security from violence and abuse. It is hopefully becoming clearer that the scaremongering and urban mythologising that has led to vulnerable and frightened people being hounded is just that, and that asylum seekers et al do not actually receive preferential treatment or go to the top of any lists. There are always exceptions, and there are some hard and nasty b***ards in the system who should have gone long since, but that should not cloud our judgement about the others.
Sid Pollitt
I'm sure you're correct Bern but the urban myths are repeated more often than the facts. I think I saw a report recently saying the felon types were being kept in Canterbury. Some of the detainees at Dover are awaiting the outcome of an appeal, some are new arrivals that are there for a short time before being released into the system, some have arrived on planes and have claimed in the first country and many, due to a less sugary diet have very nice teeth.
It looks to me as though you have not read my post the way you are going on, yes canterbury holds foreign criminals serving a sentence for crimes .Dover holds EX-criminals (foreign nationals) awaiting deportation.There are some awaiting the outcome of judicial hearings .Howard I would love to know the point of your post no. 9.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I'd have thought it was obvious Phil; made me smile.
I'm sure Howard will give his version when he logs on.
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
latest news, another sports facility has made its mark there.
not sure of the rules of this waterboarding game though.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
They have put in an application to build a dentistry there.
Roger