Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Today British Airways announced losses of £530million that doesnt include recent strikes, or the volcano stoppages, so losses likely to be far higher.
Whilst the union(unite) states this morning it wants to modernise and to talk to W Walsh chief exec of B.A. it appears the 2 sides are so far apart.
Withj B.A,. using courts to try to stop disputes(now overturned at appeal; court)
and unite annoucing 20 days of strikes.
I hope the 2 sides can sit around the table(with ACAS) if required and settle there differences.
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
How likely is it that the cabin crews have shot themselves in the foot if BA folds? It's come close to happening with Sea France.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
Trolly dolly folly!
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
BA have an outdated operating model and must make changes or go down its as simple as that. The BA cabin crew have among the best salaries/terms and conditions of any and it is costing BA dear. I was talking about this to a former BA executive only a couple of weeks ago. BA have needed to deal with this problem for a while and until now they have not felt strong enough to take on the Union but now they have no real choice, win and survive or go bust....
I think that slightly overstates the case for BA Barry. Losses of £531m wouldn't be materially affected by the salaries or working practices of cabin crew.
It just happens that BA cabin staff have the worst reputation in the industry. They are seen as providing poor customer service, being rude to passengers and generally behaving in a superior manner. They may even be overpaid.
But, there are bigger problems at BA, and they mainly centre around excessive salaries and poor management. I know of fairly ordinary IT guys there earning in excess of £80kpa for a job worth lessthan half that. If that is indicative of the organisation something needs to be done about it; but start with the management team.
I think Willie Walsh is a talented but overly arrogant man, but he has inherited an airline with huge Reserves, giving him time and money to make the changes required, no matter how painful. BA will survive for sure.
What we see from Unite is a typical old union stance of fighting change. Hopefully Unite will be crushed as a result of this '1970's' behaviour.
Maybe ACAS can ride to the rescue but I suspect this battle will go to the wire as the the leaders of both sides appear to be stuck in a 70's time warp.
I have to agree with Barry they are the best paid already , the airline industry is in trouble as it is without theese strikes .
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Sid, dont get me wrong I am not saying that the losses are all down to cabin staff pay, that is not the case but it dont help. Its the whole outdated business model run by BA that is the problem that needs changing and to do that the T&C's of staff also need to be dealt with.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
its bad management that are unwilling to give or take conccesions in talks.thus those who are lucky enough to have a union to negoeate on there behalf may get a better deal than those who dont.if all enployers like willie walsh had there way all staff would be on a low wage,minimum wage or less with no benifits at all.
But, all employers aren't like Willie Walsh; he is in the minoirty.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
sid,same train of thought.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
More power to Willie Walsh, if he does not win this then BA is going nowhere but down the pan, if he makes too many concessions it may struggle on for a while but wont last long.
Once again backward looking unions are placing the jobs of their members at risk.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
it saddens me to see a british icon hurtling towards oblivion.
neither the bullying willie walsh or the useless and intransigent union leaders really care about british airways.
both sides are just looking to win personal battles.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
barryw,thats what happens when bosses dont listen to the workforces repasentaions,bosses dont go to the shop floor the bread and butter of any busisness,the only way bosses can out problems is actully talking with the workforce and getting there hands dirty so to speak,gets more respect that way.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
just seen the loss figures for british airways, these are up until the end of march, so the volcano effect does not come into it.
taking away the losses caused by the disputes, they still lost 500 million quid, what sort of businessman is willie walsh to preside over such a disaster?
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
yes howard one does wonder.
It depends on the starting point Howard. WW has trimmed £987m OFF the airline costs in the last financial year, thereby almost balancing the books. It sometimes takes 2-3 years to turn a major business around.
Agree with Brian though, bosses need to get to the 'coal-face' on a regular basis. The downside of that however is the boss then tries to micromanage, and that is fatal to any business.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
At least WW and union leaders meeting quitely(so ww says)
hope dispute can be avoided
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
kieth,only time will tell if he is sucesfull or not.might evan have a change of management in the end.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
BRIAN
I would like to share your faith.
But I think WW as Barryw says is there not in the better interests of the workforce, but instead to smash the union
We saw it with maggie
we now see it with WW and the Govt carefiuly supporting BA.
There are very wide imlications for this dispute, both in the BA company, but also he wider outside work forces
