Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
8 February 2010
07:4139967The best one Howard was their (Hoverspeed's) seacat from Dover direct to Ostend;just a couple of hours, then you could stay in Ostemd for a couple of hours and then drive to Bruges for a while, or stay a few nights.
Their First-Class service was fantastic and great value for money.
Roger
Guest 673- Registered: 16 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,388
8 February 2010
18:2840034It is now confirmed that the Norman Spirit will run Ramsgate-Ostend as the Ostend Spirit. The ex Brave Merchant will be chartered to run Dover-Boulogne. She is one of the four racehorses originally operated by Norfolkline. Basically a freighter with accommodation for a few hundred passengers. The changes will take place from the second half of March.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
8 February 2010
18:4040035Good news, hasn't really been something I would call a proper ferry from Ramsgate for a long since the old Sally the Viking Line
Might have to give it a go
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
8 February 2010
18:4140036Wonder if they will take Footies ?
Been nice knowing you :)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
8 February 2010
20:2840053doubt if they will take foot passengers, too many adjustments at the port required for minimal return.
hope that i am wrong.
with regards to the new dover/boulogne service, will the passengers have to be complete with cars?
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
9 February 2010
08:1940072LD Lines personnel will be in Dover on the 11th. of February giving out leaflets; there'll probably be discounts too, so look out for them around the Market Square area.
Roger
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
9 February 2010
08:5240076That's good news, thanks for the information Ed .
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
9 February 2010
11:1040082it must be costing the company a fortune, with all this chopping and changing.
admin, promotion, reregistering vessels and changing booking and ticketing arrangements must mount up.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
9 February 2010
11:5540086Lord Warden, Maid of Kent, Invicta, Canterbury, Maid of Orleans, Hampton, Shepperton et al, legendary names, permanent, meaningful, and always remembered. Norman Spirit renamed Ostend Spirit, Brave Merchant. Am I a sentimental fool, or are all these modern day names and renaming`s dull and meaningless?
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 693- Registered: 12 Nov 2009
- Posts: 1,266
9 February 2010
14:5740100I may be being a little obtuse here, but why should a vessel change its name just because it's used on a different route? Isn't it supposed to be bad luck to change a ship's name?
True friends stab you in the front.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
9 February 2010
15:2440102Absolutely pointless and meaningless, unless of course it`s an excuse for the company director`s to have a binge. Not sure with your last bit Andy, but I`m sure it would be so in centuries gone by with many superstitious seaman.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 673- Registered: 16 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,388
10 February 2010
03:5840166The British Railways ships names above are first class. BR would normally keep a ship throughout her life and the name would usually remain unchanged.
Nowadays, it is common for one company to own ships specifically for chartering out, another to charter the ship, another to manage it, another to operate it, etc, and for it to pass through many hands during its lifetime.
The Norman Spirit was previously owned by RMT then P&O. She is now owned by LD Lines who prefix their ships with "Norman." However, they have entered into an arrangement with TEF where the latter will charter her, with LD concentrating on the passenger side and TEF on the freight. She is going to be repainted with a TEF white hull with both TEF and LD insignia. The name change is probably to reflect the fact that she will no longer be pure LD.
The Brave Merchant is one of the four Racehorse class ferries originally owned by Norse Merchant Ferries who used the suffix Merchant. The original owner must have been a horseracing enthusiast as the first part of each name is derived from famous racehorses.
Brave Merchant was named after Dancing Brave, Dawn Merchant after Dawn Run, Northern Merchant after Northern Lad, and the Midnight Merchant similarly after some other gee gee. They had paintings of horse races on the bulkheads outside the passenger lounge and a brass statue of a racehorse inside the entrance to the lounge.
They have all passed through several hands since with the Brave Merchant's last employment being as the "AVE Liepaja" in the Baltic, where she is currently laid up in Gdansk. She will presumably be renamed Norman something and, since she is a ROPAX ferry (roll on roll off freight with a bit of passenger capacity), which is a wise choice for the run, I suggest she is named Norman Wisdom.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
10 February 2010
07:4340170lol! Norman Wisdom...like it!
You speak with a far greater knowledge on the subject than me Ed but are we really sure the Brave Merchant is a good choice for the Dover-Boulogne run. What it shows to me is a shift in the marketing.
The new route started off in fine style with the Norman Arrow ( after a temp vessel), aiming surely, and fairly and squarely, at the Tourist market. We remember the initiatives with RogerW and LD Lines about tapping into the new tourist potentialities. I still have the photo of Nick Stevens and Roger lurking somewhere in my near distant archive. Using the seacat type vessel was designed to catch the tourist eye as the restaurants and shops of Boulogne were seriously interested in an influx of trippers from the UK all spending bigtime. And why wouldnt they be.
The Norman Arrow wasnt fully functional in all weathers so a swift departure there to sunnier climes. Enter stage left the current incumbent..the Norman Spirit. This ship has worked away through the winter in regular but low-key fashion. But now when it sees a chance to flourish on the horizon, spring being around the corner, it is also moved on. Enter stage right...the dour but functional Brave Merchant, with no tourist trappings at all. You cannot market a ship like that to the general public as a tourist vessel, "cruise the channel on the Brave Merchant..I dont thinkso..." which seems to indicate that the have essentially abandoned the tourist market. Seafrance and P&O market their ships in a "the holiday starts here" way and people believe it and like it, because its accurate. I myself always use Seafrance and indeed your holiday begins once you get onboard.
So have LD LINES shifted their expectations on the Dover - Bouolgne route? it seems that way.
Guest 673- Registered: 16 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,388
The Norman Bridge (ex Brave Merchant, Blanca del Mar, AVE Liepaja), takes over from the Norman Spirit on Dover-Boulogne as from 18th March. She is currently receiving attention in Gdansk preparatory to entering LD service.
As from that date, they will not be carrying foot passengers as the Norman Bridge only has a passenger capacity of 400. Pierre Gehanne points out on his blog that daytrippers can take a car with four passengers across for around £24 return and parking is easily available in Boulogne. The racehorses have a very large well-appointed lounge with all-round views and a bar so it is not the end of the world on a 1h45m crossing.
As Paul says above, using the Norman Bridge instead of the Norman Spirit is definitely a downgrade from the point of view of tourist passengers. Freight is King and the Norman Spirit has apparently built up very good carryings in this respect.
Norman Spirit will become Ostend Spirit on Ramsgate-Ostend and operate in tandem with Oleander, ex Pride of Free Enterprise. Again, they will not be carrying foot passengers, although a daytrip to Ostend would be a very long day anyway.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
thanks for info ed, sorry to see that the boulogne ferry will not take foot passengers.
i never expected the ramsgate/ostend to do so for the reasons you have given.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I wonder when LD Lines will publish this news. The fare sounds fair.
Roger
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
to be honest i would like to see the ostend/zeebruge runs reinstated.yes i know they are long expensive runs but would bring dover the full complement of ferry services it used to have in its glory days.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
If it's not financially viable, it's not going to happen Brian.
The ferry companies know when and whether a route is viable and it seems LD Lines are able to change, when the demand changes.
Roger
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Thanks for that information there Ed, very useful as ever. Somehow though its a sad turn of events. Not so long ago we were all heralding the arrival of the new exciting FAST ferry service to Boulogne, with our own Roger in harmony with Nick Stevens, launching a tourist drive, so it is clearly a watering down of the original intentions. When I was on the fast craft Norman Arrow last year it was most definitely full of tourists..kids the lot..the full monty. Not many facilities onboard but it was fast and I think people enjoyed the difference. Of course the tourist traffic is only in vogue for a relatively short time in the summer, hence the problem and hence the swing back to freight. Pity though..somehow. The great tourist aspirations have clearly hit the dust...and clearly no Boulognese came in this direction.
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
With the quantity of freight traffic on the increase it is no wonder that LD Lines will provide a ship with a high freight capacity. Norfolk Line publically recognises the importance of freight in its operations and it is freight that keeps all the companies going. I doubt any of them could survive solely on tourist traffic.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!