Courtesy of Wikipedia:
Born in London, David Miliband is the elder son of Jewish immigrants Marion Kozak, from Poland, and the late Marxist intellectual Ralph Miliband, who fled Belgium during World War II.
He has said "I am the child of Jewish immigrants and that is a very important part of my identity."
Both his Polish Jewish paternal grandparents lived in the Jewish quarter of Warsaw. His paternal grandfather, Samuel, a trained leather worker, fought for the Red Army in the Polish-Soviet War of 1919-1921 before moving to Belgium.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
SID
My preferred choice would have been alan johnston but sadly he ruled himself out.
Going to take some radical changes and a hard job for who ever gets it.
k
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
These are the reasons I like the Miliband brothers.
I'd also feel better represented by someone who is the product of a state comprehensive education, rather than an out of touch Etonian millionaire, who thinks that by not wearing a tie and rolling up his sleaves is 'down with da people'. Cameron also likes popular music, claiming The Jam's 'eton riffles' to be one of his 'faves'. This to me demostrates his ignorance.
It's alright though he has taken a £7.5k paycut. An amazing gesture showing that we all have to make sacrifices in these hard economic times. Good job you paid off that £1.5m mortgage Dave and you're family wealth is only estimated at £30m, hard times.
But he does roll his sleaves up on that poster so he is just like us...not.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
The Milliband brothers are both very good indeed and a true product of the modern Britain, and very representative, what with so many of us coming from such diverse backgrounds now. The sons of immigrants made good. I think the Labour Party is very fortuinate to have them right now as there seems to be such a shortage of real leadership material within Labours ranks.
My particular favourite of the two is David as I think he is a very engaging individual and is capable of giving either Clegg or Cameron a bloody nose at the polls. I think DT is right in that the silver spoon aspect may well have stopped David Cameron running away with the election completely, people know he isnt going to experience tooo much hardship whatever happens, and will for example be easily able to absorb the rise in VAT to 20% and so on...whereas they wont.
Keef I like Alan Johnson myself, I think most people do, alas though its starting to be ever a younger mans game as you can see. To have someone ermmmm elderly across the debating rostrum from Boy Dave and Boy Nick wont work. Ive reached the age myself when policemen are starting to look young!!
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Paulb
I hear wot you say, don't agree though, Alan johnston very good at engaging, as for the clegg/cameron they have/will damage themselves and thats going to be good to watch.
The labour party will re group and hopefully change the ways it does things top down.
I'm from a left leaning background, but under blair even i noted we were in opposition forever unless labour changed, but he went to far.
lets watch this space and see how things go
keiythy
Unregistered User
I am afraid the TV debates have changed for ever what people look for in a party leader, David Milliband fits the bill Alan Johnson does not, Johnson apart from the TV issue would make a fine leader.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Now i know one of the many reasons i got out of politics
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Labour will be out of Government for at least a generation due to the complete balls up they have made of the economy (and most other things...)
Interesting to see how class bigotry is so important to so many sour grape Labour supporters.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
BAZ
I will allow myself to go off message with the title just this once.
(you heard it here first)
the tories/lib dems will have damaged themselves so much.
Labour will be back sooner than you think
But a lot of your postings are very blinkered so i do understand
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
People are not that silly Keith. everyone knows who is responsible.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
MRP yes the debates have changed things, but also so has the role the leader plays generally in all this. It has become almost presidential like the US. Years ago people may have basically voted for the policies, or their local MP, or whathaveyou, but in recent times the personality of the leader has come hugely into play.
You can see this with Gordon Brown. No matter what he did, and he was quite good in the leadership debates, but no matter what he did and what Labour stood for, the people out there just wanted to be rid of him for good. His personality ruled the outcome above all else. Even his own party recognised this beforehand and he was airbrushed out of election lierature and so on. He generally fought a good campaign, apart from that one voter incident, but even if he gave away free money, he was destined somehow to head straight into the pages of history. No matter what he did or what he promised he just wasnt going to win....and Labour paid the price.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
Yes I agree Barry the upper-class are a bunch of bigots. Actually the subject matter of the song 'eton riffles'. As Paul Weller remarked about this being one of Cameron's top tunes. " if he can't understand the lyrics to a simple song, what hope has he got of running the country well?"
I'll make myself clear: I'm not a Labour supporter just someone that believes in fairness. Our country being run by the same group of people is not fair. Most of our prime ministers have been Etonians, which suggests the position is held by the priviledged...hardly democratic.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
The true bigots are those on the left DT1.
The reason why so many Cabinet Ministers are from public schools is the failure of the comprehensive 'education' system.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
BAZ
now you have me not speaking on the title again you naughty boy!!!!!
Lets be fair (and maybe a little honest)
If you have the dosh, like many etonians, you are destined to go far, not always on ability but more because dosh talks.
Thats not a fair system.
Its nowt to do with jelousy, more to do with how do even up this unfairness, and help the less privilidged,
think its a fair observation
And therein is why there will always be a Conservative and Liberal party in one form or another. Socialists want equality, but not by raising themselves up and challenging, but by dragging others down, thereby stifling opportunity for all.
As for the Leadership of the party, I would have liked John Hutton personally, if for no other reason than he appears to be an honest man, something Labour hasn't seen for 15 years. I do like the Johnson fellow too, who also proves you don't need to go to Eton or Harrow or Westminster to a lead party. My own view of the Millibands is, one has broom sticking up somewhere painful and that accounts for his stiffness, and the other is a thug. of the Brown ilk.
Leaders taking off ties and rolling up sleeves was started, as I recall, by Bliar. Falling over in public was started by Kinnock (possibly as an homage to Ford).
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
my choice would have been alan johnson, the fact of the matter is that the next tv debates will be when he is 64 years old.
saw ed miliband for the first time this morning speaking, very eloquent, media friendly and all that.
made me cringe when he takes jacket off and walks around when speaking, he must be employing the same drama coach as the prime minister.
one the brothers will win and lift the reds back up again.
I would of liked to of seen a woman go up for the job.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
The main thing that state education fails to offer to students is the 'networking opportunities' prevalent in the private sector. The parents of the students in these schools have rarely 'raised themselves up', but are merely the perpetuated product of these schools themselves. This is what stifles opportunity, a system that maintains the status quo through nepotism. Occasionally people break through, but these are still statistically in the minority.
As for the effectiveness of state education it costs around £6k per year to educate a child, with average classes of 20, compared to £12k per student in the private sector with average classes of 10. Educationalists agree small class sizes are key to discipline, progress and achievement. So if we double the state funding then we could actually compare the two, which we can't at the moment. Increase this to £30k a year (The Eton price tag) and we could get it down to a handful of kids in each class, then we could have a real comparison.
Smaller class sizes would make a real difference, something that won't happen with public spending cuts. This being said small classes don't benefit everyone, just look at Prince Harry. That being said, the state education system could just cheat for students and use the extra money to fund law suits against art teachers.
Labour had 13 years to deal with this, and failed miserably. The challenge has to be to get class sizes down and the quality of teaching up. That we are still having this debate so many years after the creation of comprehensives tends to indicate that experiment, whilst fine in principle, fails as a solution. But why?
No one answer to this, but dumbing down quality to hit arbitrary goverment statistics and unrealistic industry HR expectations doesn't help. Should we pay teachers more? We definitely need more teachers, so perhaps get rid of class room assistants and reinvest that money in paying teachers properly.
Has anyone here looked at what is required to become a teacher? The Labour government ran an extensive campaign to get people from industry into education. The trouble is, what they required from candidates compared to what they were offering in recompense wouldn't encourage anyone to make the switch.
Maybe it's time to get the educationalists together to find a solution, and keep the idealistic and interfering politicos out of it until a recommendation is made.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
I don't think Labour have 'failed' miserably, although I am not saying that the system is a complete success. Over their 13 years, Labour have almost doubled the spending per student, showing a clear commitment to education. This has been able to facilitate smaller class and supporting teachers. However we are still a long way off the level of funding (% to GDP) provided to Scandinavian countries, which amuses me because the Conservatives rightly see Sweden etc as successful in education (as do educationalists) but are happy to cut funding, the opposite of the Scandinavian approach.
The arbitrary statistics set largely by the National Curriculum are more representative of demographics and do little to improve standards. The achievement (or not) of these standards are just used as a beating stick and a desperate way of proving that the state could learn a lot from the private sector. But then Public Schools (An antiquated term that speaks volumes about class bigotry) do not have to follow the National Curriculum and so can concentrate on education rather than meeting mindless targets. Bureaucracy is generally a fault of the Left, but the Tories did a pretty good job of introducing plenty. Double the funding to the state and introduce the NC to private schools, let's see how they compare then.
Also our new government propose the abolition of CVA (contextual data) to their 'League Tables' ensuring schools and pupils in more deprived areas are reminded of their 'failure' (by the governments definition). E.g. A child in Dover may make more progress in his/her education than one in Tonbridge Wells, yet still 'fail' because this is below a national average. The teachers in such a context possibly work harder than those in Tonbridge Wells yet their school is placed under scrutiny by HM Inspectors.
I don't think that paying teachers more is the answer (although this may entice more from industry). It is a case of providing more funding, getting class sizes down (thus improving discipline, something people seem to think is a case of beating) and offering every child the chance of a good education (not necessarily wholly academic) irrelevant of wealth. Then we can see people pull themselves up through society, rather than be put in place by an antiquated system of privilege.
