5 February 2010
23:5239737#1
I enjoy blogs and forums and especially like DoverForum. Recently I found a terrific article AGAINST forums which, while nothing more than one grumpy sod having a rant, does manage to inject a certain point-of-view that forces you to question the actual "value" of online discussions. On the surface it's just an angry outburst, but deep down this is actually a very clever and well thought-out argument.
So guys, FORUMS, MESSAGE BOARDS, BLOGS, SOCIAL NETWORKING. Is it a GOOD thing (as I believe it is) or is it a BAD thing (as Matt Edwards thinks)? Read his article and have your say...
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AGAINST FORUMS - by Matt Edwards
You, reading this. Yeah, you, at the keyboard. You think you're pretty special, don't you? You trawl the Internet looking for articles to add comments to so that you can grace the world with your opinion. We all trawl the Internet too, but we're not looking for places to have our say, we're specifically looking out for your opinions. That's because you're so bloody good. You've managed, with no research or education on any subject at all, to be the one person who's right about everything. Film, music, politics - you're right about it all. We need you to right all the world's wrongs. You're amazing, you are. Special old you.
I think there are two main reasons that forums are so crap.
One reason is that most people, most of YOU, are awful idiots with nothing interesting or insightful to say. Not only that, but even if you did have something to say that was worth hearing you wouldn't know how to express it. Throw that under a cloak of anonymity and everyone seems to think they're either a superhero or a super villain, bringing justice to message boards and comments forums all over the web or making the most outrageous comments they can to get a response, and you'd have to concede that, essentially, the Internet is a wasteland. It's like the diary of a million inarticulate wastrels.
The other reason is that people don't know the value of their opinions anymore. They sit at home and watch X Factor and get to choose what happens. They get to talk on the news as part of real factual reports to give their opinions. They can publish blogs. People receive constant reinforcement that their opinion is of equal worth to the next person's, which means that an educated opinion is worth the same as an uneducated one. If you can't see the problem with that, yours is the uneducated opinion.
It's time to accept that your opinion isn't worth anything. You don't know about pop music, you shouldn't be voting on X Factor and choosing the next big pop star. You don't know about filmmaking, you shouldn't be writing long winded diatribes about what professional filmmakers are doing wrong. You don't know about economics, you have no business analysing the effects of BAA's financial performance on the market. You only know about serving people overly-complicated types of coffee. When that topic comes up, that's when we'll be looking to you for input. When we talk about the menial nonsense you use to fill your day, we'll be heading straight to you.
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
6 February 2010
00:3739739#2
Interesting.
A certain amount of truth in there too - as someone once put it "we all have opinions and we all have a***holes, unfortunately most of the time most of us do not want to hear either".
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
6 February 2010
08:4039740#3
I suppose coming from me this might seem a bit odd but Im NOT a fan of Forums at all. They have two things wrong with them right from the off...they are generally anonymous and generally open to all.
The anonymous aspect usually results in outpourings of non sensical bile and when the thing is open, this attracts other bile spewers into the fray..and in no time at all you have an unmanageable cesspit. Forums may have more chance of success on a global scale than they have in a small town capacity, as in the small town capacity the legal situation can become untenable.
Doing Doverforum we have kept the idea 'small town', and hopefully have ruled out the two basic flaws mentioned above. We no longer in a way regard this as a Forum at all but a discussion group, a membership club - and thats the only way we are prepared to do it. I think most of us have seen Open Forums self destruct before our very eyes.
6 February 2010
10:4339748#4
Ross - I loved that! Perhaps there is a bigger point there, though. But one of the positive things about forums is that it has given people an opportunity to express themselves with others and an opportunity to learn. I know that I have learned a great deal from the people on this forum, and on one or two others: the experience and knowledge of all the people who gather here is breathtaking! And I also get a laugh out of it. If only for that it is worth it!! I love someone who makes me laugh!!
6 February 2010
11:0239751#5
Well, a very amusing article/rant, but what is to say the guy is informed or uninformed? There are great holes in his argument which tends to lean me to him being uninformed, humorous, but uninformed. In which case, why should I listen to him?
Guest 643- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,321
6 February 2010
11:0739754#6
Well all I know is that if I want to know anything about Dover I come straight to here and if it's not there I can ask and get a good answer.
But then as PaulB says - it's not a forum - we all "know" each other
There's always a little truth behind every "Just kidding", a little emotion behind every "I don't care" and a little pain behind every "I'm ok".
Guest 657- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 3,037
6 February 2010
11:4439762#7
Interesting article and I agree with what PaulB has said.
Like anything forums have their advantages and disadvantages but I have to say that Doverforum is one of the friendliest!
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
6 February 2010
11:4839764#8
Interesting posting from Rick, (and Mr Edwards). If he posted on here, this would be my reply.......No, I`m not special, I don`t trawl the internet (life`s too short), but you say you do, not for a say though, but just to look for opinions. You haven`t got any? What would you trawl the net for if no forums? No research or education on any subject. I love to read, research and educate myself in alot of things, but I`ll never be an expert or authority on any subject I learn about, and never pretend to be. No one is. I don`t know about films or politics so I don`t form an opinion, and music is too varied for anyone to say what`s good or bad. Forums are crap? Crap in this sense is the same as the words atheist/blasphemous/racialist, just a word to write everything off at a stroke with no proper meaning. I have heard of an idiot, but I don`t know what an awful idiot is? Special old you? Not me mate, never have been, never will be. Something interesting to say, but not knowing how to express it? Yes, you have a point there, but then it`s not always easy to express the point you mean, so that it`s taken the right way. No anonymity with me, so we`ll move on. Blogs, no I have no blogs, so we`ll move on. Watch the x factor? Don`t watch tv full stop, so we`ll move on. Don`t watch or listen to the news either, move on. Complicated coffee`s? Normal coffee is fine, but prefer tea. And that`s it.......... It could have been me some time ago, with Mr Edwards posting, and when I first came on here, it was to tear into Dover and the state it was in. I have mellowed somewhat, and as I`ve said before on here, it`s the discussion with a number of individuals on here that has bought it about. PaulB has it spot on regarding keeping it a small local group. Imagine it as the corner shop. You don`t want it to become the sprawling supermarket do you?
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
6 February 2010
12:2639767#9
Top post Colin, well done.
6 February 2010
12:5739768#10
I love forums. LOVE THEM! But there are problems with them. What Matt Edwards is saying (and, I admit that I do have to agree with him to a certain point) is what PaulB echoes somewhat - the people who hide behind an anonymous icon feel utterly free to spurt whatever bullcrap they want. But the positive value of forums is simply exponential. Amid all that crap and bile, there is a wealth of useful, meaningful knowledge and shared wisdom, if people take the time to filter out the scum (easily done with the little "search" box). I simply cannot even begin to guess at how many times I have found forums to be the ONLY source of useful info at times. An unusual query about a special effect, or a weird problem on a bit of software, or a lesser known recipe, or a poorly advertised helpline number, or a good supplier of timber fixings... I could go on forever with this list but these are all things that FORUMS have helped me with. Google is great at indexing forums because there is so much text for it to spider through.
It's like everything in life, all good things in the world attract *****, lots of them, and before long the "good" users are mixed equally with the "bad" users and it's the "bad" users that ruin the reputation for everyone.
You'd have thought that my favourite forum would be the big movie one on IMDB.com, but nothing could be further from the truth. This is a perfect example of Matt Edward's hate campaign, a forum so packed with ill-informed morons slagging the hell out of movies and each other that it really is a wasteland of barren intellect and venomous human sewage. There's few other forums like it. It's the most savage, depressing, futile experience on the web. But, there are countless great ones out there and I believe forums are a shining example of what industrialised technology blended with political freedom of expression can achieve, and overall they are outstanding.
I suppose that forums are still very new in the grand scheme of things, we just haven't fully figured out how to use them in a broad social sense. One day we will but we have to go through this turbulent period first while we learn.
6 February 2010
13:1039769#11
Colin - lovely post, thank you.
Unregistered User
6 February 2010
14:1639774#12
I'm with Rick.
Watty
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
6 February 2010
16:2139778#13
Good points there Rick, the only thing I`d mention on, as far as this forum goes is anonymity. I`m happy that so long as there`s an overall `person in charge` if you like, and is aware of all his/her members, then that`s fine with me. Despite the fact that I`ve only met Howard on here, (very pleasant chap), and everyone else on here are still anonymous, I would equally trust all the other members on here even though all are anonymous to me. If it was open house, and a forum of heckler`s and bullyboys were shouting out their views on here, that would be the end for me. I`ve done a few years of much buying and selling on Ebay. Over a thousand of those members I`ve dealt with have been great to communicate with, but are all anonymous. Look at some members negative feedbacks, and see the opposite, plain nasty some of them, which fortunately, I`ve never encountered. And yes Rick, forums could be the future.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
6 February 2010
16:5539788#14
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6 February 2010
17:5139790#15
Excellent video there Bob :o)
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
6 February 2010
18:2439798#16
Most amusing Bob.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
6 February 2010
19:4239806#17
Watched that cartoon half dozen times this afternoon/evening before making a comment, only because it was so short, but found it completely irritating. Sorry, but perhaps it smacks too much of modernism, if that`s the word.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
6 February 2010
20:4439817#18
a very interesting thread, excellent posts especially from rick and colin.
post 12 from paul, i am not sure about, will have to study it in detail and digest the contents.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
6 February 2010
21:5239841#19
Hadn`t done it before, but after Mr Edwards trawl of forums, I typed in forum on the internet and came up with Sheffield, amongst others. Interesting to see their posts, but PaulB, you have no competition. Their smiley looks like one of those Japs you see in the old war books. There`s a God debate going on there this evening, so I might join up shortly, they look like they need a stir.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
6 February 2010
22:2139844#20
Don't get me started.....!