Keith, the point about the Alliance is it doesn't matter what you vote in GE's, what does matter is a passion for Dover being run by Dovorians and not influenced by national party politics, as is the case with both Labour and Tory party candidates. National politics and issues should not decide local elections.
Vic's, "vote for the person not the party" sums up what the Indies, and other Independants are about really.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
SID;
I share your view on local town councils, and all the true 7 labour cllrs in there own way (like other cllrs) are doing best for Dover.
Without getting to bogged down on LABOUR, In my time I'm not aware of National labour party ever having any influence within dover town council.
I outlined my view to Mr Webb recently, and think on many parts we agreed!!!!!!
But you would say that Keith, wouldn't you.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Sid
In my postings iv been open and honest
said it as it is.
anyway its unfair this posting is on ukip
so as iv given my opinion many times will refrain from postings on this posting
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
I will go along with Mr Perkins on this one in locals look at the person and not what party he or her is in,and if you think that is the person for you then vote for them,and I feel by doing that we will see more geting done not only for Dover but the District to,if they are aready Cllrs look at their records and see what and how they have done,do they work in their own wards or just a face which some are,do they go to council meetings there are a fair amount that do not,are they working for the town and the district,do they sit on any committee,or sub-committee,do they hold any kind of office-ie chairman of any committee,do they turn out if you call them,look of the sighs and if it is yes to most of them then vote for that person,if it is a no then you need to look at voting for somone that will and please again do not look at the party they might or not be in.If you follow along those lines we should end up with agood working council working for the wards and the town and the district,and it is not all about Dover, a District Cllr does have to do both his or her own patch but the whole of the District to,so keep a eye open for that to.What will I be doing next May standing or not standing?I can not say at this time,the public on many times now have not back me or what I think is right and I will not change in anyway what you see is what you get,so the sighs are that I might not stand anymore,but carry on trying to put some events on.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
VIC
You have announced your retirement from standing.
As you say you have shown by the chess compo. thats where some talents lie.
You don't have to be a cllr to get results
But Andy, it is common knowledge that right wing anti-EU Tories are finding a home in UKIP. The challenge for UKIP is to dispel that view by broadening their suport base, which I am sure you, Vic and Alexander will be trying to do here in Dover at least?
On that basis Chris has a point, surely? No need for the wild over-exaggeration of what he is saying methinks, but if you need them I've got an old pair of Jackboots that will polish up nicely!
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Keith, you speak of working for Dover (as I hope all Town Councillors do) then you undermine your own argument by insisting that the only 'true' Labour councillors are those who toe the party line. Last time I counted there were 4 Alliance, 1 Inependent, 1 Conservative and 12 Labour (who did you forget?).
You can't have it both ways, are the Labour members free to vote as they feel right for the best interests of the town or can they only be counted as Labour members if they vote in bloc?
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Andy I made a simple (albeit slightly flippant) remark about a basic distrust of foriegn influence being a part of UKIP's make-up. You leapt in with the accusation that doing so was somehow bigotted and to which you added a long and defensive argument. At that point I moved the debate away from the thread for which it was inappropriate to here.
The two quotes from manifesto's was to show that there is a strong similarity between the UKIP and BNP stances on immigration (in fact the UKIP could be considered more worrying as they feel the need to put in about 'humane' holding facilities which suggests there could be another type). Xenophobia suggests a distrust of foriegners or foriegn influence while bigottry suggests a total unwilingness to consider other points-of-view, which of these is being displayed most strongly?
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
I tjough the indies did better than 4
thats even worse than i thought!!!!!!
please chris don't try to kid me or others the alliance doesn't include the tory and as you call her indy.
but labour having 12
farbetter than i thought!!! well 8 if yiou get my drift!!!!!!!
Decision making is left town cllrs )(labour) as far as i know
the labour group meets like the alliance meets to discuss ways forward for Dover.
please Chris don't try to muddy the waters by pretending your alliance party supports labour.
And your allianc party as you say will have stratergies to defeat labour.
As I'v said iv been honest and said it as it is.
Sadly not everyone wantts s to be as honest.
but thats fine.
sad for Dover but thats fine.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Sid mentioned earlier that you can never persuade 'party prisoners'. Nowhere did I pretend to support Labour, and I am very sorry that you cannot grasp that not everyone falls into a red or blue party trap. There are far more shades of opinion out there and simply following any parties ideology is way down the list of things this town needs.
Once again you are contradicting yourself by only counting those Labour councillors (in what appears to be your view, although I am sure some of them will quite rightly think differently) hold to a party line. I realise it is difficult to break out of the old habit that if not Labour must be Conservative or not Conservative then Labour but it really is worth the effort and better representative of the wealth of opinions held by those in the town.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
chris
you will have problems convincing sid or blue barry of that.
anyone not completely right wing is automatically classed as a socialist.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
And there are parties out there who think the Labour party is far too right-wing. Takes all sorts.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Excuse me, speaking for myself, I am true blue for GE's as long as they represent my thinking. At local elections I will not vote for national party's because all their candidates are like brainless sheep running after their lord and master wherever he may be.
Local people, like Vic, BigDave, ChrisP get my vote in the locals as they are closer to what we need in Dover.
I don't want the Transport House thought police, or the Tory Party gentry making local decisions thank you.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I understood that there are two factions of Labour Town Councillors, split more or less, straight down the middle - those who support and only support, Labour Party Policy and those who have a mind of their own; then there's Alliance Party; the sole Conservative, who is very poorly and the one Independant - independant from any party.
Keith, it is disingenuous of you to say the person concerned, always votes with the Alliance; she votes for what she thinks is the best policy at that time - as every one should.
Roger
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
I am very sorry to hear the news tonight that the chairman of UkIP in Dover had two of his post,s taked off this UIKP page .My Cooper as done some very good post,s on the forum over the years and not only for UKIP, I have beed told that he will not come back .Unless his post,s were very rude and with bad language,which it was not.
He was only giving back as good as he was geting ,(Well it was better ) but if the Dover Forum took him off just for that,then they should also take off the person posts he was replying to,it is unfair to just take one of them off.So please will you do one of to things(1) Replace Mr Coopers posts.
(2) Take the other persons post off aswell.
Mr Cooper will be missed on the forum by all of us and again what you have do to one should be done to both.
If should happen we might just see Mr Cooper posting again.
Vic, Andy was asked a couple of time to rein himself in a bit by the Gruppenfuhrers, but obviously was unable to do so. Ergo, action has been taken. It wasn't done without warning you know.
As local leader of a national party Andy has to be beyond reproach in his dealings with all-comers, even though he may be seething inside.
A time of calm and reflection won't harm.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
There was nothing wrong with his wording I have been told.(And not by him) I did not see the post,s but I do know Andy and again he does not use bad Language Etc.But what is good for one is good for two.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
sorry vic, sid is right, things got out of hand and too personal,andy is welcome to post as always.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
you have taken it out on one person the posts that lead up to that should also be taken out,This could turn into a big thing so please lets see the other ones take out to,before it all blows up.