Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
The minimum wage has proved to be a great success and a real vote winner amongst the general public. It secures a liveable income for the lower paid and ensures teenagers trying to earn an extra crust are not exploited. It was one of the more popular innovations of the 11 year Labour reign and is continuing to be popular with the general public, as we all have someone at the lower end trying to earn a few bob and trying to make ends meet.
Today the rates increase as follows:
22 and over, the rate goes to £5.73 per hour
18-21 rate becomes £4.77 per hour
younger ones must get a minimum of £3.53 per hour.
So there you have it.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
I am not sure that it is such a great success as you suggest.
I am convinced it causes more problems than it solves, though with the influx of cheap unskilled labour that the Government has allowed into the country there would otherwise have been a downward pressure on wages.
I would have preferred no influx of cheap labour and no minimum wage. I suspect if that was the case wages would on average be higher in low skilled jobs. The minimum wage is established as a norm and has damaged wage competition for labour.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
baz
You have said before you don't believe in the minimum wage, you would let people just struggle on in poverty,
thats why this came in anyway, its not as high as it should be, but its a start.
your just showing the true face of the conservative party
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Keith - I have said that I do not believe ion the minimum wage for the simple reason it locks people in to poverty.... Get it right!
The minimum wage represents the kind of short-sighted simplistic thinking that has so damaged social mobility in the Labour years.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Unfortunately Barry that must be some sort of dreamworld if you think that without the minimum wage there would not be a lot of companies looking to cut wages. One well known and worldwide supermarket group, coming to a seafront near you, is known around the world for trying to keep down its wage bill to the cost of its staff. Known worldwide because of the amount they have to spend on legal costs fighting cases on their treatment of staff.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
minimun wage should be 7.50p an hour for all regardless of the size of the company.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
barry its seems from your postings about the minimum wage,that would pay peanuts to the workforce rather than giving them a fair and proper wage for work done,and dont forget workforce equlls profit,we are one of top countrys in the world and not a third world country,wasnt the torys who invented out sorsing.
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
A long awaited crackdown on minimum wage rogue bosses has been launched.The Government is planning a fresh crackdown on bosses who fail to pay the national minimum wage.
The Government said tough new penalties will come into force next April, including fines for employers who genuinely forget to increase wages when a worker turns 22.
The Employment Bill, currently before Parliament, will introduce an automatic fine of up to £5,000 for businesses found underpaying their workers. The most serious cases will be tried in a Crown Court, which will have the power to impose unlimited penalties.
In the last year, enforcement officers investigated more than 4,100 employers and secured almost £3.9 million in arrears for more than 19,000 workers. Since the minimum wage was introduced in April 1999, over £30 million unpaid wages has been returned to more than 100,000 workers.
Dave Prentis, general secretary of Unison, said: "With rogue employers constantly seeking new ways to evade paying the minimum wage, the Government must be vigilant in enforcing it. The rise to £5.73 is a welcome cushion, however, a more realistic figure would be £6.75 an hour."
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Thanks for that excellent report there Marek. Very interesting. I think many of us would like to see it that bit higher but at least it is edging upwards anyway..which is to be welcomed.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
The key to the piont I am making is that competition for labour is the best way to raise wages. labour have imported a mass of low skilled labour and that would have indeed provide a downward pressure on wages if not for the minimum wage.
However if they had not done that then a shortgage of labour would be handled in the market with higher wages being offered. It is a normal market response. I would maintain that the minimum wage has become a norm in many occupations and sectors of the economy and as such is locking people in to low pay.
This suits Labour, of course, they have a vested political interest in people being locked in to benefits. The Conservatives have a vested political interest in social mobility and people being able to improve their lot.
I accept that my argument is a complex one and not a simple populist one that is easy to explain like a minimum wage but it is no less valid for that.
The evidence of what I say is in the reduced social mobility since Labour brought in its minimum wage and tax credits.
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
Barry
You can still have competition for salaries ..so long as its above the minimum wage.Would you really trust individual corporations many owned by overseas companies to pay the British worker a fair days pay..no they would be haggling the salaries down in order to enhance their profits for their shareholders .The work force would again lose out whilst the Directors et al paid themselves huge sums of money.No there has to be some form of regulation.
If elected will the Tories scrap the minimum wage deal?
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Sadly no Marek.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i have asked the question before about the minimum wage under a blue government.
i have never had a reply and the subject was never raised at conference.
the idea that labour gains from locking people into the benefits system is a discredited one.
life long benefit people do not vote, most do not even know when an election is on.
seems a bit of a generalisation, but ask people who canvass at election time?
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Barry, just look at the figures in Marek's posting, If it was not more vital than ever to have an imposed minimum wage then those figures would not exist. The Conservatives 'trickle down' theory (that giving money at the top will work its way down to everyone) has always been a complete nonsense, the very rich are so because they keep their money. The only way to get more money circulating is to give it those who will spend it, those at the bottom end of the income scale who have aspirations and a need to acquire.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Howard - you can judge that from the results over 11 years so there is considerable evidence for what I say.
Chris. Do you actually know what 'the rich' do with their money? I do, I advise many people who you might regard as wealthy (and others not so rich) on what to do with it. You are wrong. Perhaps you think they tuck it under the bed....
I stand fully by what I say. Remember we had much greater social mobility under the 18 years of Conservative rule than under the last 11 years.
People who have money, invest and save, are responsible for themselves and their family and who stand on their own two feet are the bedrock of our society. They are also far more likely to vote Conservative. I want everyone to be like that and professionally I help many people to work towards that (everyone starts somewhere...) I know a little about economics and family finance, Labour policies are guaranteed to achieve one thing, through handouts they lock people in to poverty.
The minimum wage eliminates wage competition in creating a norm. Also keeping the wages of the low skilled low is an oversupply of cheap labour thanks to this Governments open door to mass immigration.
The greatest enemy of the poor is the Labour Party, who often with only the best of intentions, damage the economy through excessive tax and spend and damage the capacity of the less well off to improve their circumstances.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
barry
i think that you know very well that the underclass did not put labour in power.
all the research by experts show that the disenchantment of blue collar, sunreading people towards the blue people
was created by mr major and his chums.
mondeo man(as so described) was being socially mobile.
they then saw the new dawn from our tony and his speeches from the pulpit, and the fact he surrounded himself with lively younger people that were goimg somewhere, hence the 3 election results.
the underclass spne their time arguing on the "jeremy kyle show" watching "big brother" and reality television
and trying to keep up with celebrities.
most think that the credit crunch is a new brand of biscuit.
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,695
so, let me get this right....
it would be better for the british economic, social and political system to go back to workhouses for the poor, children up chimneys etc.
No?
Thought not
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Barry, surprise surprise, I do know rich people, as well as poor and inbetween people, and most of the wealthier people I know keep there money, that which is not kept 'off-shore', in property or share portfolios where they hope to get bigger dividends from companies underpaying their staff.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Actually Ross the opposite. It is better to generate much more wealth through economic activity from which we all benefit. Labour always destroy that, every one of their Governments has ended in economic crisis.
Chris, I suspect from what you say that you know little about how these things really work. What is more I think there is a good chance that I know a hell of a lot more than you do about how such people invest, where they invest and the workings of that investment. I speak from knowledge not envy or prejudice as someone who provides the advice on what they should do. You are on to a loser on any 'mine is bigger than yours' exchange on this subject.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Whas most important is the number of people helped by the minimum age and tax credits, watch out if you vote blue cos they will go!!
on the benefits system there are aspects of it that Baz and I would be close.
let me again share a few,
I don't feel anyone should just be able to pick up dosh(benefits) and are fit for work why should they be able to sit at home all day?
there does need to be a radical change in this area, but both labour and tory parties wont touch one.
As iv said on here before Frank fields(far to right wing for me) Labour MP did have some radical proposals, but blair kicked them into touch.
they are not vote winners for either party so they won't touch it.
CHRIS
Blimey mate, here I go again agreeing with you !!!!!
The new store ASDA yes, worst employer around, but sadly the generalpublic don't see that side, and just welcome a new cheap store.
I'v already said Dover needs a boost and Asda won't be the answer to Dover's problems(if they come that is !)
Whos the candidates for the St Radigunds bye election any one know?
