Guest 666- Registered: 25 Mar 2008
- Posts: 323
#1
Saw this on the TV and had previously thought that it was an 'April Fool' spoof type of story, is it for real?
Was linked in with lottery grant story and the updating of the wartime tunnels.
All interviewed on the Meridian news appeared rather bemused by the idea.....any Dovorians in the know please advise.
Oh Boy!, That'll be the day.........
Terry Nunn
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,321
#2
Looking at the list of topics, at the moment "Cable Car For Dover?" is followed by "How Stupid Can You Get?"
Nuff said!
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
#3
#4
Another crackpot idea. Words fail me. Some suit on the news said he sees Dover as 'the new Barcelona', or some such piffle. Has he ever been to Barcelona? Or for that matter ever gone so far as to look out of the window of his ivory tower without the use of a blindfold?
A major civic project such as a cable car for Dover would be all well and good if there was a town beneath it worthy of enticing people to stop, shop, live and visit. A cable car would be ideally the last piece in the jigsaw of a fully-revitalised town, giving the place an extra 'wow!' factor.
As it stands, this ridiculous project, after all the consultation, presentations and other bureaucratic guff, will prove to be merely £4m of wasteful flim-flam, misdirecting funds while the town it will not touch (no need to explain further the irony of that) continues to haemmorhage at ground level.
As a proud Dovorian I so want to be proved wrong, but it'll never, ahem, get off the ground.
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
#5
Good point there Andrew, with Barcelona you have a port - snap, cruise facilities - snap, a marina - snap, a sandy beach supported by a magnicent array of restaurants - ermm, the best european stadium and football team in the world - ermm, a former Olympic stadium - ermm, the Familia cathedral, the home of an avant-garde designer, not just one, but TWO cable cars. To say that Dover is the 'new Barcelona' is as you say pifle
, Barcelona is a city with enormous capital funding, expenditure with major investment from both private and corporate sectors.
I hope that the cable car does get off the ground but ... at what expense to the town.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
#6
As I said before I have been runing with this now for over 10years with D.D.C. E.H and D,H,B.
It will be good for Dovor.
Vic Matcham
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
#7
A cable car for Dover? I think Terry's previous posting says it all.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
#8
It's a good idea, but only time will tell how good.
My issue is the fact that this is another concept that will be drawn up in isolation from other plans. I'd like to see a proposal for the town that thinks about all of these ideas as opposed to lots of different 'bits'
Some of the posts here are a little negative and Dover is certainly not Barcelona but new connections in an awkwardly planned town could present so many opportunities. I can't help but think what sort of statement we are presenting giving tourists a 'Gods eye view' of our approach to town planning in Dover.
On top of this; if pencester is an element in the cable car plan, I think this requires the powers that be to look at what is being done on the St. James site, as the axis of the town suggested by the Rummey Design proposal should be reconsidered.
#9
The St James' area redevelopment plans (remember them? Quiet at the moment, isn't it?) should go back to the drawing board immediately. Asda (yes, remember that?) would simply replace the current urban carbuncles with more of the same (if in doubt, just look at the vile aesthetics-free lump that is the Folkestone one in Bouverie Square). And that's not even mentioning how much more hideous the emphysema-inducing traffic would become.
A more far-reaching and sympathetic solution for this benighted section of the town (and my word, has it got some rivals all over Dover) would be in part to re-create a semblance of the pre-War St James' area street pattern, like a more compact version of the North Laine district of Brighton (not 'The Lanes' but the 'North Laine' - look it up), with varied shops, restaurants, cafes, housing, a couple of boutique hotels and a couple of open public piazzas, reconnecting the Market Square area through an opened up Flying Horse Lane and Fishmongers Lane and Bench Street with Russell Street, Dolphin Lane and Woolcomber Street.
Whitefriars in Canterbury has done this 'reconnection' thing very well. Even the open space approach of Westwood Cross isn't so bad, either. Any archaelogical finds when excavating the St James' area (and boy, there'll be loads) should be either incorporated sympathetically into the redevelopment or at least visually referenced after their removal to Dover Museum, to act as a historical signposting of the redeveloped area.
And speaking of reconnecting parts of the town to each other, why not put the long-dead duck of the Charlton Centre out of our (sic) misery and thereby open up the gloomy, doom-laden and frankly scary area between its rotten self and the forthcoming Morrisons (oh yeah, remember that too?) superstore site, Maison Dieu Road and what passes for that bit of our High Street from the bottom of Tower Hamlets to the corner of Ladywell.
Then, and only then, should we start talking about flipping cable cars.
Lots to do, eh, whizzbang business brains out there? Best of.
Regards all,
Andy
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
#10
With reference to the 'Whitefriars' development in Canterbury, could Dover avoid the one error in that plan and acctually include public toilets in a visitor intensive area. Whitefriars was designed with none.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Terry Nunn- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,321
#11
There are some Chris. They're on the outside by the Park and Ride stops. You need 20p to get in though, tough if you're caught short and short of change!
I've long been anti DTIZ. You can't put any development that will generate huge amounts of traffic on a road that even now gets clogged up regularly.
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
#12
Well said, Terry. Asda and Co - if it ever happens - will just replace one monstrosity with another.
A truly horrible development. But hey, what's new? We've had horrible, disjointed destructive town planning since the late Fifties.
Andy
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
#13
I think you are right Andrew, I know (must be two years ago now) I made my objection to the DTIZ plan on this forum, saying true mixed use, similar to many plans in Holland would be more suited. To create something with a similar scale to what was on the site pre-war would be great. I have only seen plans and pictures from that period (obviously as not even my Dad was born) but something similar, although slightly higher density coud really be something!
I have been to the North Laines when a friend used to live in Brighton, and as for Whitefriars I remember attending a lecture about the master planning of the project years ago, well before they had any brand backing(a good job although I prefered some of the other schemes) Both very different approaches to regeneration (although more capital), and both are a world better than we have been offered.
As I said I don't want to be negative towards the cable car, as it could be a great asset, it just has to join up with something more than is on offer in the town currently or after Asda (I think we're in agreement on that) I just think the cable car should be a part of one definative plan rather than six dilluted ones!
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
#14
Apart from objecting to the Asda development on the gropunds of the increased traffic congestion, detrimental effects of a cheap supermarket with an avowed policy of undercutting all competitors on other businesses in the town, the attractions of a large empty car park to the less desirable elements in the town and other reasons, I haver never considered it to have any tourism potential. There is no way potential tourists will see a monolithic block of a supermarket and think, "hey, must visit Dover they've got a supermarket". A cable car offering rooftop views of the same? I don't think so.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#15
we seem to be getting back to the issue of the DTIZ.
there was no other offer on the table, the choice was to wait another half a century or take what asda had to offer.
i am not sure that the whitefriars development is an example to us.
firstly, canterbury has a much larger population and visitor base, secondly a lot of the lovely olf buildings that housed
shops and businesses are now falling into disrepair.
terry is right about the bogs, i used to creep into fenwicks for a swift "gypsies kiss", even they charge now, and have a turnstile.
not so easy to pole vault over when you get older.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
#16
Sorry Howard, there is a popular misconception here, long promoted by DDC, that Asda was the only offer on the table. Theirs is the only offer for the whole site, there have been other proposals over the years, including for liesure facilities, which could have been looked at. Had they been followed through it is quite possible that the area would not be an issue now. It is this obsession with looking for the 'big fix' or the one project that will solve all the problems that has been holding the town back. The cable car is just the latest of these easy answer solutions.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#17
Leisure facilities were looked at Chris - very hard; many companies were contacted but no one wanted to come to Dover - unless we (DDC) paid for the building(s) and paid all other costs and then they could have walked away with no responsibility after a short time if it didn't work out.
That would have been irresponsible to accept those kinds of demands; all the supermarkets were contacted, but it was only Asda who said yes.
I think it is sad that out of all the various types of big businesses that were contacted, no one was interested in Dover - no leisure facility providers were interested.
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#18
i think that chris was referring to offers in the past, however they were only one offs.
they could have come and gone.
the whole area needs redevelopment, only a big player has the resources to invest in the infrastructure around the st james area.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
23 September 2008
23:056508#19
Stood on the proposed site for the cable car at the Castle the other day and looked towards the possible site in the Western Docks (I assume that this will be by the iconic structure behind De Bradlei.
PaulB - what do you think of your privacy being infringed upone by hoards of Americans peering in your window as they go overhead ??????????????????????????????????
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
23 September 2008
23:086509#20
Been nice knowing you :)
Been nice knowing you :)