howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
22 September 2008
21:466444barry
literatury is not a real word, as i think you know.
we have a wonderful language that real writers explore and use to the full.
23 September 2008
07:056445Barry - those books you deride are mainly those needing some thought to read. I alslo rather like Dick Francis et al for the pace and simple pleasures, but please, just because you don't understand a book, don't claim it is nonsense. That's a bit like someone unable to read Latin claiming it is a rubbish language!!!!!
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
23 September 2008
07:206447Latin est a mirus omnimodus language.All liberi should exsisto doctus is procul schola congruo per Bern.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
23 September 2008
08:076453Bern its not about understanding it about being utterly dull and boring.
I have a very wide taste in reading. I am just about to re-read Robert (Lord) Blake's The Conservative Party from Peel to Major, (the latest updated version, I read 'to Thatcher' a lot of years ago now). I am tempted, given our present economic woes, to re-read Friedman's Free to Choose as well, perhaps before I get into Blake. Right now though I am reading a first class archeological thriller by a new author who's name escapes me right now.
Believe it or not, I have even read Marx, followed immediately by a contrast, Hayek's great work The Road to Serfdom, these were instrumental in forming my right wing political views while a teenager. I was able to understand the contradictions and implausability in Marx and the logic and sense of the free markets espoused by Hayek.
So please dont try to talk to me about my not understanding such dull piffle as Rushdie. When I read a novel I like a bit of action, some excitement and something that sparks my imagination.
23 September 2008
08:306455I rest my case!!!
It wan't a criticism, but a plea not to dismiss what you don't like as piffle just because you don't like it, which may (or may not) be a result of not understanding it! Sadly this attitude is what often leads to some things being banned, some things being made inaccessible, just because they are not understood, or because some people do not see their value for whatever reason. I loathe Jeffrey Archer, his books, his inane grin, but I wouldn't even consider condemning his books. People who read and enjoy them are better kept occupied with something undemanding rather than out on the streets bumping into things. (That was a joke, before I am shouted down!!!)
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
23 September 2008
09:206458Is perhaps your view of his novels coloured by his politics? I know a lady friend of my deceased former wife who was very left wing, and I do mean very, she once was very embarrassed to admit to me that she picked up a Archer novel and enjoyed it!!
An amusing aside about this lady. She met my wife in Uni and 'lived' her left wing lifestyle, she was in fact a stereotype of the 80's extreme left, you know the type. She went to live and work in Communist China for several years where she met and married a Chinese man (after a 'right-on' lesbian affair to the horror of my wife...). She brought him back to the UK and I met him a number of times and we got on very well. What shocked his wife was that he admitted to admiring Mrs T and politically he and I were very much in tune!! She had assumed he would be a Communist and had never discussed these issues with him.... he is now a very successful Chinese businessman, running factories in China and he and his wife have a home in south west London.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
23 September 2008
10:266460Sorry about this Barry but you are defeating your own argument by equating artistic taste with political leanings. I am as far from religious as you can get but a look through my CD's will find Handel, Verdi and the Missa Luba, all of which I love but could not be more religious if they tried. On my bookshelves you will find books by Dickens and Plato as well as Tom Clancy and Dan Brown. I am as happy reading Batman as I am reading Runciman's history of the crusades. Archer does not feature only because I find his books trite and predictable. His style or politics do not enter into it, Edgar Rice Burroughs and Dennis Wheatly were far worse writers (their use of language was attrocious) but they had the benefit of fresh ideas and interesting stories. Most of us do not give even a first thought to a persons politics or whatever in our choice of material, all we want is something that we will enjoy.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
23 September 2008
17:546485Absolutely. And I have read the Thatcher books,MichaeFoot,Denis Healy, Bill Clinton, the Alan Clarke diaries and so on. It's the pleasure not the politics!!!!!
Guest 677- Registered: 8 Jul 2008
- Posts: 150
23 September 2008
18:316490I'd just like to say that I've read all the Harry Potter books (I know that's going back some but I've only just read this thread and wanted to put in my twopenneth). I have also seen all the films, that last three on the big screen. I think they're brilliant. I've got to say that I really don't care what JK Rowling is like as a person, or that there are other fantasy books that are better (hopefully I'll get to read some of them, but it's all a matter of taste isn't it). I read for escapism and they fit the bill beautifully. And only someone who hasn't read them could say that they were specifically for children.
Continuing with this I'd just like to add that a while ago a friend came to my house whilst I was reading a Nora Roberts book (she writes romance and romantic thrillers, very good if you like that sort of thing) he asked me why someone of my intelligence read that trash when I could have been reading biographies, history books, theological debates etc. I'll repeat what I said to him because I think that some people should hear it. I read what interests me so that I can have a little escapism, I do not read to impress others, why the heck should I cos in the end no one will be impressed. I'm not directing this at anyone so please don't jump at me I just thought that this might be an interesting thought.
It's not the man in my life, its the life in my man!!
24 September 2008
07:376510I am just as happy with a Mills and Boon as a Descartes or Sartre, a Daily Telegraph or a Rushdie or Salinger - it all depends how you feel when you sit down and pick up! And if reading gives you pleasure, go for it!!!
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
24 September 2008
08:256513Steph. you are of course right, that is why most of what I read these days are escapist novels with the odd urge to read something more factual as I have right now.
Chris. I am not equating artistic taste with politicals leanings as such but am relating it on a more personal level. It so happens that most of my preferred authors, Clancy, Forsyth and a few others do have right wing views but there are others who dont.
I see you mentioned Dennis Wheatley. His use of language does look dated to us these days but I dont think it would have beeen viewed as attrocious in his day, far from it as he was very popular among 'middle class' types. My parents did not tend to have many books in the house, except the comic annuals that I had for Christmas as a child. So I never went through a childrens book reading stage and went direct to reading adult books. When I was aged about 12 and off school ill, a neighbour brought me a book to read, Codeword Golden Fleece, a World War 2 Wheatley novel. I was then hooked. My favourite Wheatley's were his seven WW2 Sallust novels which I loaned to someone and never did get back!!! I just never did read those classic children's novels that so many look back fondly on.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
24 September 2008
11:246529Never too late Barry. It can be amazingly relaxing to read some of the childrens classics, as I have rediscovered by finding them for my children. The Grimms fairy tales, in the original not the Disney versions, contain some great twists that you will have forgotten and there is nothing like Brer Rabbit for destressing at the end of the day.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 644- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,214
24 September 2008
11:396531There is an awful lot of pretention in artistic and literary circles, to be seen to be reading a certain author or admiring a certain artist is seen to be the 'thing to do' whether or not there is any real understanding there. How many times have we seen politicians being interviewed with book cases full of intense histories and political tomes behind them that one can almost guarantee they have not actually read. Where could they find the time?
Ian Fleming's James Bond novels are hardly great literary works full of clever language and philosophical debates, yet just look what they spun off to become! I'd rather read one of these than something by Rushdie any day.
Just read whatever you want and let no-one tell you otherwise.
(Anyone like to borrow my copy of Spot Goes Fishing?)
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
24 September 2008
12:166536Got it, read it. Do you want to borrow some of his other adventures?
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
24 September 2008
16:436550barry w try reading animal farm or 1984 all by the same auther differant as chalk and cheese.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
24 September 2008
18:266551I did read 1984 many years ago though not Animal Farm (other than reading a few extracts in my time.)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
24 September 2008
19:216557i found both books rather patronising, they both tried to indoctrinate the reader by "subtle" means.
i think that the real name of orwell was blair, i may be wrong
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
24 September 2008
21:276566He was indeed Eric Blair.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
25 September 2008
16:076602any relation to tony blair?
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
25 September 2008
16:476604I hope not. If you call into W H Smith's at the moment you can pick up some great 'childrens' classics for only a quid. Was in there earlier and availed myself of a new copy of Jack London's 'Call of the Wild'.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour