Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Prime minister question time
just announced tories shadow tory health secretary has said they will CUT public spending by 10% if they get in govt.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Not enough.
We need much more drastic cuts than that thanks to Brown's spending binge, I would like to see at least 20% with only Defence exempted.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
At least your honest unlike cameron at pm questions
sadly he aint as honest and hes your leader
Here goes......as a leftie it pains me to say this.........but there is much to be said for up-front openness about difficult decisions that have to be made rather than either flanelling the electorate with promises that will be impossible to keep, or attempting to maintain the facade that we can continue as we are. Not that they are the only options available and it would be nice to see someone with the b**ls to start the conversation about alternatives, but as it stands, perhaps it's Respect to someone who will say the unpoplular.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
BERN
Im also very left wing, but that doesn't change the fact, its open now and our barryw adds to it. a 10% cut in public spending yet the person who announced the cuts couldnt even be at question time to justify the tory cuts.
how many doctors to lose jobs
how many nurses to lose jobs
how many teachers to lose jobs
when will they be told
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Keith.
The actual truth of where the 10% figure comes from is the IFS analysis of DARLING's budget, which includes (hidden away in the small print) 7% cuts per annum, from 2011 I believe. Because of Conservative ring fencing of health they calculate that to match the same overall cut, other services would be cut by 10%.
I suspect that whatever Party gets elected there will have to be bigger cuts than that. The economic situation is so dire and the budget so overestimated economic growth there can be no other option.
I believe that the best option is a 20% cut starting right now.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
well your more open than your own shadow health spokesman who has gone into hiding.
So theres a clear divide between the 2 parties
at last ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
well your more open than your own shadow health spokesman who has gone into hiding.
So theres a clear divide between the 2 parties
at last ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
well your more open than your own shadow health spokesman who has gone into hiding.
So theres a clear divide between the 2 parties
at last ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Frankly, although I abhor the idea of cuts in health and education, the fact is there are layers of people in those arenas who would not be missed. Sometimes it is about better resource management and education of staff than about numbers.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
BERN
I would even consider that view if i felt that was where cuts may come
but its more likely as i say to be cuts in
Doctors
Nurses
Teachers
etc etc
There are some doctors, nurses and teachers who shouldn't be there! If there needs to be a review of resources, all staff should be included in that: if they are not performing, or not necessary, or not delivering, why keep them? Part of the NHS challenge is to manage an unwieldy monolith in bite-size chunks in order to reduce waste and inefficiency. That's one good reason why smaller cottage hospitals are a good plan: easier to manage, easier to monitor, and the increased costs in maintenance are balanced by a saving in personnel and wastage, and in a better more targetted service delivery.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
yep and labour announced today they would be reviewing that.
theres a big big diffrence between supporting the N HS and public spending support.
And -tory CUTS across the board if you get a tory Govt.
The first time we have had such a POLICY announcement by the tories!!
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Clearly Keith you did not read what I said or are choosing to ignore the facts I pointed out.
Health is ring fenced under Conservative plans, something I would not do. That does not mean there wont be savings in the adminstrative 'tail' to spend at the front end of patient care. Anyone who thinks there cant be a re-allocation of resources within the Health budget to get more benefit from what is spent is deluding themselves. Bern is absolutely right to say what she did.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
barryw
and your not listening to your leader and shadow spokesmen
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
Maybe the Tory leader and shadow Health Minister should be listening to BarryW, or not play down the inevitable cuts. A bit of up front honesty and realistic justification is needed I think, and not just in the health arena but across the board.
As far as cuts go the first place to start, it seems to me, would be the Civil Service.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Actually they are saying exactly the same as me except I am urging at least double the level of cuts LABOUR are planning.
Here is part of an article analysing this by Fraser Nelson today which explains exactly how the figure in question is arrived at:
"""""Budget 2009 proposed total real-terms spending falling by 0.1 percent a year for three years starting April 2011. Those figures Brown read out in PMQs represent a real-terms cut as any half-sentient economist will tell you. The IFS spotted the complete trick the day after the Budget. Factor in the rising cost of debt interest and it implies that public service spending will fall by 2.3 percent a year. This makes a cumulative 6.7 percent over those three years. This is what Labour proposes to do if it wins the next election.
The Tories have (until today) given no figures - but they won't spend more than Labour so their cuts will be at least as harsh. But David Cameron has indicated that he'd increase health, meaning that the burden will fall more sharply on other department. In effect, this means cuts of 3.2 percent a year, for those three years - so a cumulative 10 percent. Crucially, this is a Labour cut, determined by the cuts spelled out in Budget 2009. Brown thinks he will win this debate, as the Tories will be honest about cuts - demonstrated by Lansley this morning - whereas he will be dishonest.""""
Here is a link to the full article, it is an interesting one:
http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/3687378/the-truth-behind-that-10-percent-cut.thtmlGuest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
So the honesty is whichever wsay you look at it
The conservatives will be making public spending of OVER 10%
thats all i was saying
provesd to be correct thats fine
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
if they remove the deadwood that infest schools, hospitals and other public services, the saving would soon be made and no drop in performance.
we also have gp's given massive increases in pay without increasing their services.
as for dentists!!!!
ok, i will stop there.
