Guest 693- Registered: 12 Nov 2009
- Posts: 1,266
Don't know about that Brian, I haven't seen her lately. But a very old widow by now, she can't have long left.
True friends stab you in the front.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
andy,saw her on the telly a couple of months ago some news programe was showing going to some birthday bash.put it this way her spitting image puppet looks better than she does know.
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
Andy,
I said earlier that there was a problem with the balance of power, back then, with the unions. Much the same as the pigs in trough syndrome, that's occurring now, with the rich getting greedy.
I am not stupid, I know what the agenda was back then. If we leave out the part "who started it" We in Kent were left with the Fact that our pits, were going to close, if we went on strike or not. Ordinary miners in Kent were fighting for their future and lost and let's not forget Betteshanger was breaking records when they shut it.
Kieth, "tory govt had an agenda to destroy the N.U.M"
She destroyed the NUM to bring the other unions to heel, there is a big difference there. She used us and our families as whipping boys and I will never forgive that. There should have been another way to solve that problem. Thousands should not have suffered for the few.
Roger,
We agree on Skivers but why are they always your focus, they rip off £100's, while some big business and some rich, rip off £1,000,000,000(is that enough 0's?) and you never speak of the two together? One is probably needy the other is definitely greedy.
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
She's not broken Brian, just got old.
Roger
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
I have just read this post on the NUM site; I thought it fitted in with this thread.
25 years ago I lived in Surrey, my local Bobby went up north on police duty against the picket lines! Yee God I was so ashamed of my nation and what they allowed Thatcher to do. So I sold up and left England. It has not been easy but I could not stomach the ignorance that stared me in the face and did nothing about the rape and pillage of our country that has gone unabated ever since. If you get a chance to see the stage performance of Billy, go, it is sad and profound and beautiful. It brought back the time of the strikes as if it was yesterday. We all have hard times ahead and never before have we needed the unions as we do now. Only when they became established was the need greater than now. Now we have another type of poverty to sort out and in a way it is a far more difficult poverty to rid ourselves of. Government corruption under any title and corporate payoffs to keep democracy out of our reach. It truly is wake up time. Good luck and may your God keep you safe and united.
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
roger,thats a matter opinion,old and broken.
garyc,a very moving post.
Moving? No. Irrelevant? Yes! No sympathy being shown to a worker with no striking rights whatsoever. Did the idiot who wrote that pathetic screed actually consider how his local Bobby felt, I suspect the bigot didn't give it a second thought because that type rarely thinks of anyone other than themselves. He admits to "chickening out" by leaving the country, what sort of patriot is that? More like a traitor to his fellow workers. Shame on anyone for extolling those views.
GaryC, I have some sympathy for the actual miners families, but, did Maggie actually force or call you guys out on strike, or was that something you decided for yourself? Maybe, and I know it won't be pleasant, but those who withdrew their labour perhaps ought to be looking at themselves for the demise of their industry, not some politician who took steps to protect the nation against another damaging strike. Remember, we'd just got rid of the hopeless Callaghan government who were being ruled by the unions. The country didn't want that type of government anymore. Three election victories does tend to send a message.
Why didn't the unions listen to the nation? Because they were being run by old fashioned, self-serving egoists who were busy lining their pockets and too arrogant to see the writing on the wall. They threw their members to the wolves of public opinion which was firmly against them. That battle was always going to be lost whatever the cost, more fool the union leaders for not seeing it. Sadly, the workers also paid a heavy price for ignoring the obvious messages too.
The first rule of battle is "Know your enemy", Maggie did and they didn't. Who is to blame for that?
Brian, Maggie is a very old woman, would you prefer she undertakes the Squelch treatment? Even Tony B Liar is beginning to show signs of ageing, as we all do. Don't be so bloomin' daft lad.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Well well this thread has moved on a lot since I last looked and a lot of very predictable stuff posted too. I wont bother to run through a lot of old ground other than to back up Sid, very well said.
The Unions were a 'clear and present danger' to the UK and needed to be brought to heel. They remain now far too powerful in some industries, such as the airlines, and still need to have their wing clipped.
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
Sid Perkins.
Oh doesn't the arrogance show through. SHE was not condemning the PC, read it properly, who's the idiot?
Her type? What type is that then, any one that does not agree with you?
She has principles, solid ones, not ones that can be pulled out of the hat to suit your arguments.
You're very good at name calling "bigot" "chicken" "patriot" "traitor" "egoists" "Know your enemy" Shame on you for extolling those views.
I have never been an enemy, I do not need your sympathy and whatever the reasons or whose fault it was, my pit, Betteshanger Colliery was a well stocked geologically stable mine that was going to be shut because of some arrogant A---Holes who could not act like adults and sit down and talk.
We did not "withdraw our labour" We went on "strike". I will shoulder some blame in reacting too quickly to Thatcher closing Corton Wood. We did fall into her trap and we lost the strike and lost our mines.
But I will never apologise for trying to keep my families and my community's only means of employment, its social structure and everything else that went with it alive.
If you do not know what has been lost in this corner of Kent because of our collieries closing and I don't think that's the case, then its me that sympathises with you.
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
GaryC, I was not trying to make a personal attack on you, so apologies if you thought I was, and I do understand how much this subject means to you too. I use aggresive and emotive language sometimes when writing about or even to, our so called betters. They aren't held to account nearly enough in my book, and as Keith and others will testify, I rather enjoy "going after them". Sometimes the language is necessary to get them to make any sort of response, although GP is clearly impervious to anything said about or to him by local voters.
Returning to your posting, you quoted the words, "police duty against the picket lines". Now that to me is a very emotive statement, suggesting the police were AGAINST pickets and not ensuring the law was obeyed, which is of course their job, one in which they do not have the luxury of strike action or freedom to refuse to obey orders.
I don't particularly care if it was a he or she that made the statement, their action was to get out of town and leave the struggle to others. Maybe I should have used the word "coward"? You didn't pack your bags and run away did you? No, you stood up for what you believed in and that will always command respect. Nevertheless I still think you were all misguided by your leadership. If you think the Union bosses of those days were not self-serving, egoistic and working to their own agendas, then maybe time hasn't helped us understand what really went on back in those days.
As for Betteshangar, Tilmanstone, Snowdon I don't know the economics much more than to say, there may be huge stocks of coal waiting to be mined, but what is the actual cost of getting it out of the ground? The nation has moved on from huge loss making job protection schemes, aka Nationlaised industry, so unless a profit can be earned it doesn't matter what tonnage is available, it ain't going to be shifted, and rightly so.
What those in the now defunct or privatised industries forget is the tax-payer was subsidising their living and for great swathes of the UK workforce, there is no-one subsidising theirs; so why should they have to pay their hard-earned money to keep others in work?
The counter argument is obviosuly going to be, better that than paying out benefits. Well, actually no it isn't. What we actually need is for our legislators to get those bouncey things used in tennis and amend the rules for employment in the UK to re-enfranchise the unemployed and dramatically cut the need for migrant workers.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
sid,i have seen what damage can be done to an older person [over 60] and its not very pleasnt i can tell you.so therefore maggie has gone past her sell by date.thanks but no thanks.
I agree Brian, but she was right for her time as was Tony B Liar. We need something new and not tainted by old battles or prejudices to take UK Plc forward. I'd quite like to see a "Britain and British First" slogan from one of the party's, but I doubt it will happen except from the BNP, and I don't want to go down that road.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
Sid,
Like you I find it difficult to give a view, as that is all it ever is, because others may feel im attacking them.
I treatr everyone the same, yes i have a left leaning political view but thats my choice.
Yes sid, sometimes I find it difficult to understand your tones, but i HAVE always respected everyones right to post.
GARY
You misunderstood my posting, I did in part clearly state Maggi e main motive was to destroy the wider trade union movement, via takingo on the NUM.
Those days were so diffrent, and like I also said trade unions modernised, and we see very diffrent trade unions from those days.
Gary to be fair ROGER did once recognise the MP's OF ALL PARTIES with noses in the trough, he dislikes as much as those who abuse the benefits system,
he has ONCE made the same comment on those greedy bankers.
That said it does appear he (Roger)posts a lot more on the benifits system.
We all have family or friends, affected by the miners dispute, it was a very sad time, sad to see communities destroyed
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
I too responded to Sid Tones and I also respect his posts.
Keith, you was right with what you said and I wasn't referring to you saying that, I was just picking up the point and moving it along a bit, if that makes sense?
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
I can not find my page on coal I have looked at all the 81pages, but I think this is a good time to put it back up,so if you can find it please let me know. Thank You.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Vic if you go to the Members Club central page or anchor page..on the top right you can see a small icon called SEARCH. Use that to find previous threads. It works well..all the stuff is there somewhere if you know what your looking for. Add a post and it brings it all back to the front.
Obviously this only refers to this version of doverforum. Older defunct versions are gone to the archives in the sky.
