Weird Granny Slater
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,002
Oh well, Momentum it is then.
In an appealing reversal of the normal 'socialists envious of other peoples' stuff' narrative, it would seem that the Tories are happy to risk soiling their well-manicured hands by thrusting them into Momentum's grubby pockets to finger the many treasures that jingle there.
Michael Gove's assessment is that "…a few months ago people would have thought of Momentum as a group of people who were completely ideological who were being manipulated by [Momentum founder] Jon Lansman and various others, and who were a threat to democracy... I think people will change their view now… that actually Momentum brought lots of enthusiastic young people into politics, provided them with an opportunity to campaign for things in which they believed and that it also helped change the culture of the Labour party… I do think we can learn something from them."
https://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/politics/michael-gove-conservatives-can-learn-lot-momentum/
Giles Kenningham, a former Tory director of communications, lamented that "Labour have used Momentum to devastating effect. The Tories do not have an equivalent campaigning group pushing out their message."
http://www.ifashops.com/labours-slick-online-campaign-outguns-tory-press/
They should get the Curry Club onto it, or better still the Fresh Start Group, or the 92 Group, or the Conservative Way Forward Group, or the Free Enterprise Group, or the No Turning Back Group, or the Cornerstone Group, or Better Off Out, and perhaps coordinate their activities through The Freedom Association (a misnomer if ever there was one). I mean, there is no shortage of factions in the Conservative Party. Whatever they do, I'm sure it'll all be 'on the level', 'above-board' and 'up front' and only 'respectable' people who are 'above suspicion' and approved by the 'authorities' will be involved.
Guest 1881, Guest 1997 and howard mcsweeney1 like this
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
When Momentum first appeared on the scene I thought they were just social media activists who would not be up to stuffing envelopes and knocking on doors to engage with voters. I got that wrong and it is right activists decide on policies going forward. My only concern is that many good MPs will be deselected for not agreeing with them on all issues.
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
howard mcsweeney1 wrote:When Momentum first appeared on the scene I thought they were just social media activists who would not be up to stuffing envelopes and knocking on doors to engage with voters. I got that wrong and it is right activists decide on policies going forward. My only concern is that many good MPs will be deselected for not agreeing with them on all issues.
Not deselection, but reselection surely. That was the standard prior to Neil Kinnock's 'reform'. After all, if you want a representative of the party to be a representative of the people isn't it only right that the grassroots party members get to endorse, or not, their candidate democratically?
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,860
Howard
many momentum members are the old known Militant party which appears to have gone underground since many were expelled by the labour party many years ago.
They appear to have reappeared in this new outfit(momentum) with a few additions.
How this all pans out will be interesting
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
Mr Sansum1, Momentum are predominately, but not exclusively, the younger generation of (new inspired) voters. Militant were expelled in the early 90s.
Guest 2388 likes this
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Captain Haddock
- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
1. Referring to the Militant tendency, Oliver Kamm of The Times wrote in
October 2015: "Like the Trotskyists of a generation ago Momentum is an entrist organisation that’s parasitic on the Labour host. This time, though, the far left has managed to gain control of the party structures and is intent on making life tough for Labour MPs".[23] However, Momentum issued a clear denial, saying "we will not campaign for the deselection of any MP and will not permit any local Momentum groups to do so. The selection of candidates
is entirely a matter for local party members and rightly so".
2. In
January 2017, Momentum's new constitution imposed a new
requirement for Momentum members to be members of the Labour Party.
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
So Capt, by both my definition and yours (#66) the Labour Party members should have the right to deselect/reselect their candidates.
Even the Tories have that right over their own don't they?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_HawkinsJust because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
I can assure you, from experience, that Conservatives can get both deselected.
.... And reselected!
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
Then your argument is lost on me, oh captain, my captain.
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
My 'argument' as such is that what you (and the sainted Corbyn) view as a raising of the political consciousness with thousands signing up to Labour, is no more than entryism revisited.
Trotsky encouraged it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entryism#Socialist_entrism
Tom Watson sees it
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/aug/10/tom-watson-sends-corbyn-proof-of-trotskyist-labour-infiltration
The Security Services used to monitor it
https://www.mi5.gov.uk/the-threat-of-subversion
This time around the Curzon Street Runners are far to busy to keep a proper eye on it IMHO.
(BTW, don't forget to vote!
http://www.yourlabournec.co.uk/ )
http://www.peoplesmomentum.com/nec_2017"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
Guest 2388- Registered: 12 Nov 2017
- Posts: 60
Keith Sansum1 wrote:Howard
many momentum members are the old known Militant party which appears to have gone underground since many were expelled by the labour party many years ago.
They appear to have reappeared in this new outfit(momentum) with a few additions.
How this all pans out will be interesting
OMG - I've met some of these crusty old ******** in real life, mostly sad middle aged old men and lesbians - their meetings are attended by about 4 people!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
We have one called Eric Segal in nearby Folkestone that was expelled years ago for his militant activities. Tried to rejoin the Labour party when Jezza rose to power but was turned down. The fact that he has stood as a Mickey Mouse party candidate against the Labour party many times doesn't sink in with him as the reason for rejection.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,860
It definatly NOT all youngsters there is quite a wide range of ages within momentum.
My problem howard is that I want rid of this Govt, and whilst Corbyn is bringing people on board is he and the party electable
Worse will the rest of the party move with him?
howard mcsweeney1 likes this
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
DUP and LibDem entryists in your coalitions then?!
Tom Watson's nonsense was proven idiotic - the AFL and The Socialist Party had nowhere near the amount of members that the Watson claimed were infiltrating Labour.
howard mcsweeney1 likes this
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
Meanwhile, coming shortly to a Council Chamber near you?
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
Weird Granny Slater- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,002
'Mr Gallagher resigned after he was not automatically reselected.'
'Alan Strickland…announced he was stepping down after failing to be automatically reselected.'
Seems like a theme there somewhere, and maybe that theme is a sense of entitlement. If they're not careful, someone'll trip over all those rattles on the floor.
Guest 1881 likes this
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
Button
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 22 Jul 2016
- Posts: 3,028
Is this not similar to how Ken Livingstone, like him or loath him, became Leader of the GLC?
(Not my real name.)
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Courtesy of Labour List
Labour’s wave of selections for parliamentary and council candidates threaten to re-open some of the divisions in the party which have been fading since Jeremy Corbyn’s second leadership win. The issue was revived today with a story a Times splash which roars Moderates forced out by hard left in Labour purge.
The reality, as always, is a little different. In short there have been some de-selections on factional grounds - and it would be absurd to claim there are none, or that there is an epidemic.The Times cites the cases of Samantha Jury-Dada, who was de-selected from Southwark in south London last year - “a young LGBT woman of colour, was deselected in favour of a white man who doesn’t live in the ward” as BAME activists wrote on LabourList at the time - and of Tim Gallagher, a councillor who withdrew from the process in Haringey after he was not automatically re-selected. Centre-left groups like Labour First and Progress are angry, accusing the left of a factional purge. Jon Lansman, the founding chair of Momentum, said this year however that his organisation would not be campaigning for de-selections and it simply wants “democratic selection processes” to reflct Labour’s vastly expanded membership base.
I have tried to sift through the claim and counter-claim here. What is clear, however, that any any attempt to de-select sitting Labour MPs and councillors on factional grounds is completely inappropriate. Amid Brexit, and with more than one million people unemployed and an NHS being starved of cash because of austerity, we must concentrate on fighting the wicked Tory policies which erode the fabric of our country and hit poor people the hardest. The selections for 75 key target seats - which are due to be carried out before Christmas - so far seem not to have been hugely factional contests. We have an update on the Plymouth Moor View seat, where three strong local contenders are competing for the right to take on and hopefully oust Johnny Mercer.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,935
Thanks Howard. I'm sure we are all reassured by that statement.
The slight bump with the iceberg reported elsewhere is nothing to worry about and we shall all be in New York shortly .............................
howard mcsweeney1 wrote:Amid Brexit, and with more than one million people unemployed and an NHS being starved of cash because of austerity, we must concentrate on fighting the wicked Tory policies which erode the fabric of our country and hit poor people the hardest.
Meanwhile let's keep pumping out the usual counter-factual crap rather than the truth that we are actually not doing too bad at all!
Income inequality at 30yr low
3+ Million more jobs - 3/4 full time
UK Economy up 15.8%
Deficit cut 2/3
Tax cut for 31m people
Record NHS funding
2m more good/outstanding school places
etc
etc
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
"Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds"
