Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
18 August 2010
21:4866124#61
Paul look on your own post we are the same now 6each.anyway I am off to bed now.Good night all
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
18 August 2010
22:0566127#62
Vic you and 3 other people on this site so far have been vociferous in your opposition to the sell off of the Harbour Board; even if you add on the 2,000 (a nicely convenient round number by the way) from the petition you mention this is still only 6% of the population of the town - Do the other 94% not count?
Also I will not reiterate the observations others have rightly made about the validity of "vox pop" surveys or petitions. Given these reservations how are the other 30,000 odd residents going to be given the opportunity to make their voice heard? Or are you &/or Alex somehow channeling their opinion in some sort of oracular or prophetic way?
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 643- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,321
18 August 2010
22:4466133#63
Well said Ross
There's always a little truth behind every "Just kidding", a little emotion behind every "I don't care" and a little pain behind every "I'm ok".
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
18 August 2010
22:4866135#64
Same as the hospital, certain self elected people claiming to be the view of the majority!!
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 703- Registered: 30 Jul 2010
- Posts: 2,096
18 August 2010
23:2766141#65
2000 people might sign a petition, but nobody knows how many refused to sign.
19 August 2010
00:5666145#66
Shame I am not able to attend as my family have just arrived from up North for the weekend and have other plans. I think the answer is already made anyway as it always is in the NHS so I will just sit back and watch it happen
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
19 August 2010
20:0866205#67
I did go to the meeting and i did not get up,but I feel that the council did not do a good job they had both the MP and Mr Goldfield there but only two or 3 of the council put questions to both of them the rest just looked on ,they missed a great opportunity to put both of them on the hot spot,they came way thinking well that was easy,why did I not get up ,first I would have been shouted down but that would not have matter that has been done before,but I just could not get over the cllrs just siting there like that.Well I can only say they were voted in by the public and I was not .
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
19 August 2010
22:0766226#68
Vic, as members of the public none of us (even you) have a voice at council meetings unless exceptionally invited to speak by the chair. I thought Charlie's presentation was respectful, thoughtful, plausible and to the point. Bob Goldfield's, on the other hand, started with a highly personal rant against Charlie's article in the Express this morning and continued with attempts to rubbish his funding plans. On the whole a very poor performance which showed him up in a poor light. I also thought that the occupation of the back row of seats by the Harbour Board heavies (like the bad boys in the back row on the school bus) was very interesting.
What it boils down to is this:
DHB want to sell the port to the highest bidder and devil take the town. This will plug the pension deficit and provide the town with a few crumbs. Goldfield was making extravagant promises about funds for regeneration but we all know that he and his cohorts will not be there to deliver on those promises when the port is sold off. Charlie's plan has the port owned by the townspeople through a charitable trust. In the long run that is going to be far better for the town than what DHB are offering. According to my calculations, the community trust envisaged by Charlie could own the docks lock, stock and barrel within 20 years - and regenerate the town in the meantime.
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
19 August 2010
22:1766231#69
i have read and read the proposal from charlie many times and heeded the opinions of people that have also read it.
sadly i am lost on it all and can proffer no strong opinion.
the main thing that irks me is where the money comes from in the first place to buy it for the local community.
i was discussing this recently with a chap from dovers most respected organ and he seemed to agree.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
19 August 2010
22:2566235#70
Mr Garstin,You might be right but there is not the time to put the MP plan forward weonly have till 2012 And as I said no one will buy into it because there is no return of their cash +also as i said we are seeing a big downturn in the trade at the port and with fuel cost still going up this will not stop and this is why the trains are winning at this time. I say no to both plans just let carry on the way it is there is room still for all the ships that use the port and as we see less ferry companys ,this will make even more room.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
22:2866237#71
Howard...
Your last sentence has had me in fits of laughter, my dirty mind
.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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19 August 2010
22:3566244#72
Vic, there is a strong argument for doing nothing, and after all, as an ex-Town Councillor you will know Dover is well versed in doing nothing.
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
19 August 2010
22:3766247#73
So Vic, let me get this right, your plan is to maintain the status quo, do nothing to prepare for future changes or attract new customers or develop new opportunities.
Basically run the port into the ground.
Can see why you are not running a major international business
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
19 August 2010
22:3766248#74
jan
you will have noticed by now that i like a play on words.
one day i will grow out of it.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
22:4066250#75
Please don't it makes a pleasant change from the political rantings
.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
19 August 2010
22:4366253#76
Mr Miller, you are right just what I am thinking,it all points that the port trade will not get better for some years,so there is no need to do anying to the port at this time,and if the second tunnel does go ahead there will no need ever to go ahead with any major plans.We should sit and wait and see what happens but no sell off.
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
19 August 2010
22:5066262#77
Seems to be a lot of "ifs" there.
In my game we have a saying "Don't assume as it will make an Ass of U and Me", that is why we check everything, assess every risk, make plans to mitigate the risk, make plans to deal with the risk if it materialises etc. Funnily enough all successful businesses do the same, maybe not with quite the rigour and single mindedness that project managers apply, but they do it all the same; they also devise and develop strategies to not only give meaning to the vision they have of where their business is going, but also to deal with that which is foreseeable and to take advantage of it.
Really Vic, I never took you for a "sit on you hands fatalist", but clearly I was wrong.
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
19 August 2010
22:5566270#78
You know the old saying "about fools rush in." We are taking about alot of funding over the port and that could be some from all of us,this is not the time for rushing,and why the rush anyway, just to put alot of cash into some ones pocket and they walk away from it all, that is not my way.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
07:4166286#79
I do not think this was agood meeting for the DTC they had a full house and most of the cllrs did not say one word about the sell of the port Cllr D Hannent run the show for them ,I know most of them very well and i know they do their best at what they do but this time ,I think the public were let down by them,sorry but that is how I saw it,I should have got up myself after all.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
20 August 2010
14:3066324#80
Paul, your straw petition has no legal value, the petitions signed by the people in Dover do. Howard, it is not so that people will sign anything put under their nose, the petitions have a legal value! As for your forum opinion-pole, Paul, I do believe the nays prevailed! Whenever people try to downtread Democracy and the democratic desire of the People to be independent and maintain national Sovereignty, I will democratically combat this imposition!
Now, Paul, where have the signatures of the signed petitions gone? I want to know where they are and who is legally obliged to take note of them and give a reply. I am talking about binding laws, this is no joke!
Howard, I won't be bluffed off on this one!