20 August 2010
16:2466329I am unaware of any law appertainnig to petitions, they are an expression of opinion only and not legally binding on any party.
Guest 670- Registered: 23 Apr 2008
- Posts: 573
20 August 2010
16:5166331Quite right Sid, there are no laws governing petitions and they have little value, they are merely drawn up by people who have an interest in a particular issue and enlist the people to help support their cause. As you quite rightly point out they are not binding and rarely get acted upon.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,835
20 August 2010
17:3666337I thought petitions were used to raise awareness and feelings about a cause, that is all.
Out of interest where and when was this petition held. I had never heard of it prior to this thread and nobody at the shop mentioned it. The last one at the shop, we get a lot, being about an residential home.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
20 August 2010
17:4266340that must be the residential home in deal that charlie has allied himself with defending according to pictorial reports.
Guest 663- Registered: 20 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,136
20 August 2010
17:5766341Vic this was not the time for shouting Dover Town Council have already put forward our representation, and were there only to amend that.
At the same time to listen to the two speakers the MP and Mr Goldfield and to take in all that they said which needs to be taken away and looked at with a clear head, a lot of facts and figures were quoted and I for one need to get my head around that.
we all want what is best for the community of Dover other wise we would not be there.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
17:5966342This was done in the high St at Dover and when it was done that week in both the locals it was on the front page,Dr Rogers who does not come from DOVER came down from the midlands just to do it,because he feels the sameway as most of us that the port should stay as it is a royal port.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,835
20 August 2010
19:2566357If I remember correctly it was about Cornfields.
High Street during the day is hardly a good representation of the population, full of those who are not at working for one reason or another. I never buy the local paper, to many adverts and not enough news for my liking.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
20 August 2010
19:4166365Ross- it is all in the detail, as we know!! Plans B and C and usually D and E as well are important. Crossing those T's and dotting those i's - that's where succes lies!
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
20 August 2010
20:1766374Thanks Jan T - glad you agree, the same as the Dover Society a lot of information to take in digest and understand, not an arena for shouting personal views.
Been nice knowing you :)
20 August 2010
20:3266377An interesting evening and congratulations to our Mayor (Cllr Sue Jones) for exercising good chairmanship.
Yes Vic was quiet and well behaved...be intertesting to know what Sue said to him as this must be a first.
As has been well documented on this forum the current National Debt will result in the need to obtain revenue from "sell offs", this was already the case with the outgoing government. However as far as Dover is concerned we must have a "Long Term" investment oportunity and not just a "One Off" payment to keep us quiet.
Certainly Charlie has attempted to seek a long term oportunity as well as resolving the fear of many in respect of national security if the Port were to end up in foreign ownership..a point well made by Cllr Hannent.
If "The Peoples Port" comes to fruition then to a certain extent the future is partially in our hands. I say partially because there also has to be a will to succeed by ALL political parties at ALL levels.
As Charlie said at the outset it is to look to the future..certainly I, like many older generation, may never see the true realisation but if the cornerstone for future regeneration is in place with the will to deliver what the town needs I shall feel that at least we can leave something to our children/grandchildren.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
20 August 2010
20:5666380Thank you, Pat, for that statesmanlike post which I think sums up the situation pretty well.
I tend to be more blunt. From another post on another thread:
The DHB are proposing a sell-off of the port, probably to foreign capital. Charlie is proposing co-operative buy-out by the people of Dover. Can any of you Luddites out there tell the difference?
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
20 August 2010
20:5766381a well thought out post from pat there, sadly he is right that many of us will not see anything come to fruition.
i still have grave doubts about the viability of the plan but sincerely hope it succeeds.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
21:0766386As it was said by all at the meeting by both sides the funding or most of it will have to come from offshore cash,that means money from overseas it might not look that way on paper but it is true in will be offshore funding that buy your port is that what you wish to see,it is not for me the MPS main funding will come from offshore,DHB were open on theis one they told us yes the funding will come from overseas or as they put it off shore,just email and aske our MP will the main part of his funding come from off shore he will have to say "That could be the case."
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,701
20 August 2010
21:1266388sorry Vic your point is exactly what?
We live in an age of global capital, where there are minimal boundaries to where and what people can invest their money in.
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
21:3966394That means our port of Dover could and would go into overseas hands there would not be any jobs for local workers that also would come from over seas less cost that way,and you say in the long term we lost the war,because in the end we just gave the UK away for a few £million.
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,701
20 August 2010
21:4166396No it does not
if it is investment funds that are buying in then it depends on which fund managers fund it is, where the fund is resident etc.
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
21:5466398Mr Miller sorry but you was not at the meeting I was and I wrote down all the main points said on both sides .
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
20 August 2010
21:5966399vic
much as i admire your passion on the issue of foreign ownership it will not affect local jobs.
the new owners wherever they come from will want the cheapest and most experienced labour, hence from dover district.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
20 August 2010
22:0966400The cheapest labour will come from overseas as we all know,Again time will tell.
20 August 2010
22:3066404The way I have interpreted the two schemes are as below. I am sure if I am wrong someone will correct my assumptions.
DHB
They will as Bob has on more than one occasion seek investment and this may be from overseas funding. This would mean the "Investor" will in fact have the ultimate control. From my own experience such investors seek to have their own appointed Board Members and there is no guarantee that what is being proposed would eventually be delivered ( Non Port Regeneration). The investor will be looking for "x"% return on capital.
Charlie
The "Peoples Trust" will be capitalised by a "Loan" from a City bank. This will be repaid over "X" years. Provided there is sufficient revenue generation to serve the debt after costs and to have a surplus there is no problem. The Trustees would in fact be the Management Team thus deciding what the surplus is invested in..With the correct balance on the Management Team would see capital used for regeneration. So in this case no direct overseas investment (The Trust would not be concerned where the Bank secures its funding). In simple terms if the repayments are met by the Trust there would be no control from the bank.